Posted by: @chandykris

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Keeping the electrical circuitry complexities aside, I wonder whether such small battery storage systems can be used in niche usecases. For example, when you run the dehumidifier to dry clothes indoors, and that consumed about 1 to 1.5 kWh a day. If you can keep one such battery in the utility room, charge from off-peak and later run the dehumidifier on an off-grid mode using the AC sockets in the battery. 

From my experience, these type of usage may not be the simplest to manage. I am thinking schedules for charging, etc. Some niche cases may work if it could be slotted under kitchen cupboards using all the spare space, maybe running all the appliances from them? 

A quick cross read of this thread made me think much of it sounds very simple, too simple? How could the battery/inverter system island unless it is disconnected from the grid? Or is this using a manual switch (and how does it cope when you switch back)? Clearly no such system is powerful enough to supply 100A to your neighbours on top of your own... 

And as for running it in a wet room, let's not forget the advantage of getting "renewable fireworks"? 😆 

Posted by: @batpred

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How could the battery/inverter system island unless it is disconnected from the grid?

I suppose that you could be instructed manually to switch the main switch on the CU.  But how could it tell the difference between this and the absence of grid which by regulation requires cut out.  There could, I suppose be a manual changeover switch on the unit itself, so to island while connected to house infrastructure you need to flick the main switch on the CU and a switch on the unit itself. 

For me personally that would be perfectly acceptable, but I cant see it would satisfy the regulators or the DNO!  Im therefore currently sceptical about the claim that it does islanding!

@batpred I assume you plugin the battery on a wall socket, charge, then unplug and run the dehumidifier as if it's a portable battery that you take with for camping.

I would definitely not be running wires underneath cupboards in the kitchen. Like you say, don't want renewable fireworks!! I was thinking more like charge from a socket in the utility room on the countertop (set a schedule on the app etc), then run the dehumidifier from the battery AC sockets after unplugging the battery from the wall socket. I assume it's same as running the dehumidifier from a wall socket. 

Been jumping around pages reading about the Indevolt and it looks very compelling.

When will your review be released? Ecoflow looks good but on paper this looks better but I dont want to pull the trigger on it just yet. 

I'm keen to know UK costs.

I found this article on it but it didnt tell me any further than what is also in this thread.

https://pluginsolarexplained.co.uk/blog/indevolt-powerflex-2000-one-to-watch/

@sonosppp, the Powerflex 2000 is a really interesting product. It's taken me a while to get my head around it because there a few app/software quirks, but I'm getting there and my review will probably be live in the first week of May. I'll also publish availability dates in the UK because that's still not 100% confirmed, and I'll also try to get some discount codes.

Unless I misunderstand, that article is misleading at best:

If you already have rooftop PV and a fixed battery and you're thinking "I'd just like a bit more storage on bright days without ripping anything out", that's exactly the niche this product is designed for.

A 2.4 kW inverter is a useful number. It sits comfortably inside the 16A-per-phase ceiling that matters for G98 notification, and it can meaningfully contribute alongside a typical 5 kW string inverter — stack them and you'd be looking at roughly 7.4 kW of combined instantaneous AC output, assuming both units are producing at the same time.

As I understand it, under G98 the total inverter capacity must not exceed 3.68kW per phase. The example above would require a new G99 application which would need to be approved before connection to the grid (plugging it in).

Have I got this wrong??

Posted by: @old_scientist

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As I understand it, under G98 the total inverter capacity must not exceed 3.68kW per phase.

That's the default situation. However the Network Planner at your DNO's area office can increase this if local circumstances allow, or alternatively might prohibit any export to the grid.

The 16A per phase (3.68kW) refers to what is exported to the grid, rather than the inverter rating.
You could install an 8kW inverter which exports nothing to the grid, and still get it approved under G98 regulations.

The G99 regulations apply once the dwelling has more than one G98 appliance.

A house with an existing 5kW inverter which adds a separate storage battery would need to make a G99 Fast-Track application to the DNO.

Of course the same rule would also apply if you bought a plug-in solar module. That's one of the issues which DESNZ need to consider before the Secretary of State allows Plug-In Solar to be be sold legally in the UK.

In practice I don't think this is enforceable.

At the moment the G98 & G99 regulations are being implemented because professional installers are involved. It is they who make connections into the Consumer Unit and handle the DNO's application forms. The householder tends not to know the regulations and stays out of the loop.

Plug-in Solar and Plug-in Storage requires no professional installation. Consequently there will be thousands of homes with devices capable of exporting outside the regulatory limits, but no matching G98 or G99 notification with the DNO. This lack of knowledge poses an increased threat to the integrity of the grid.

Posted by: @old_scientist

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As I understand it, under G98 the total inverter capacity must not exceed 3.68kW per phase. The example above would require a new G99 application which would need to be approved before connection to the grid (plugging it in).

Have I got this wrong??

I filled in my g99 with ukpn without any issues. Of course , my inverter is type approved

Posted by: @editor

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@sonosppp, the Powerflex 2000 is a really interesting product. It's taken me a while to get my head around it because there a few app/software quirks, but I'm getting there and my review will probably be live in the first week of May. I'll also publish availability dates in the UK because that's still not 100% confirmed, and I'll also try to get some discount codes.

Can't wait to see more. 

Finally got around to installing and setting up the Solarman yesterday… wired it in via a plug, attached the CT clamp to the incoming live, and it’s all working beautifully. The Indevolt is now charging from excess solar. Very happy.

But getting it running got me thinking about the power outage scenario, specifically what happens when the Indevolt islands and starts feeding the house. Two questions.

1. During daylight hours in an outage, would the Indevolt’s island output be sufficient to bring the Solaredge PV inverter back online, effectively allowing it to keep recharging the battery from solar while the grid is down?

2. The more interesting one: if you have a larger battery (say 20kWh) with no gateway and no islanding capability of its own, could the Indevolt technically act as the grid reference to bring that system back to life? Essentially powering the larger battery’s inverter so it can recharge via PV simultaneously powering the house, with the Indevolt holding the whole thing together?

Thoughts?

@editor Interesting questions. If the answer to either is yes, that in itself would make it worth getting these batteries. We don't get a lot of power cuts, but if it does on a sunny summer day, it would be painful to see all the solar being produced but not able to use at home or store in the fixed batteries.

Posted by: @editor

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Finally got around to installing and setting up the Solarman yesterday… wired it in via a plug, attached the CT clamp to the incoming live, and it’s all working beautifully. The Indevolt is now charging from excess solar. Very happy.

But getting it running got me thinking about the power outage scenario, specifically what happens when the Indevolt islands and starts feeding the house. Two questions.

1. During daylight hours in an outage, would the Indevolt’s island output be sufficient to bring the Solaredge PV inverter back online, effectively allowing it to keep recharging the battery from solar while the grid is down?

2. The more interesting one: if you have a larger battery (say 20kWh) with no gateway and no islanding capability of its own, could the Indevolt technically act as the grid reference to bring that system back to life? Essentially powering the larger battery’s inverter so it can recharge via PV simultaneously powering the house, with the Indevolt holding the whole thing together?

Thoughts?

Have you tried cutting the grid feed to see what actually happens?  Im still confused as to how it can island and be compliant with the regs, which is why I would like to hear what happens when you perform the experiment.