Joining the Renewable Heating Hub forums is completely free and only takes a minute. By registering you’ll be able to ask questions, join discussions, follow topics you’re interested in, bookmark useful threads and receive notifications when someone replies. Non-registered members also do not have access to our AI features. When choosing your username, please note that it cannot be changed later, so we recommend avoiding brand or product names. Before registering, please take a moment to read the Forum Rules & Terms of Use so we can keep the community helpful, respectful and informative for everyone. Thanks for joining!
Advice on ASHP choice needed
Hi all
first time poster . I’m really getting very confused about my ASHP choice.
I live in 2016 build EPC B detached house , quite sizeable 220m2, just north of London.
i went through the very long journey of getting an octopus quote , they did 2 surveys and recommended a 8kw daikin. Heat losses c 6.4kw based on 2 surveys. Various people warned me about them (too small heat pump mainly, inexperienced installers) so got cold feet.
I then switched to Aira - heat lossss also 6.2kw , they recommended their 12kw unit which looked great and seemed to fit the bill. Long survey but 30 mins into the install has to be aborted as various things missed in the survey (like changing internal pipework).
Now have a local recommended installer coming up with much higher heat losses (11kw) and therefore speccing and LG therma v monobloc 12kw. Really ugly unit double fans.
I am really confused as to how the heat losses can differ so much - the last guy said ocotpus will be overestimating my U values and working the machine too hard. Not sure what to think of that.
My main 2 questions are : should I be concerned that the LG 12kw monobloc will be too large ? as I’ve read stories of oversizing being expensive to run if top big.
And 2 is there any other way to benchmark my heat losses ? For instance my total kWh gas usage in 2023 was 11300 kWh, does that help?
thanks!
The short answer is yes, there are other ways to check your heat loss estimate. I will post a link tomorrow when I’m at my pc. I would not be surprised if your 6.2-6.4 kW wasn’t far off. The 11kW is the outlier and sounds large based on the type of house.
House-3 bed partial stone bungalow, 5kW Samsung Gen 6 ASHP (Self install)
6.9 kWp of PV
10kWh DC coupled battery
Blog: https://thegreeningofrosecottage.weebly.com/
Heatpump Stats: http://heatpumpmonitor.org/system/view?id=60
Would recommend asking another opinion. The 11 kW heat loss seems high indeed if 2 others came up almost half of that.
I'm also surprised Aira would install a 12 kW heat pump in a property with 6.2 kW heat loss. That's way oversized.
On Octopus, you mention a concern about too small heat pump. An 8 kW Daikin for 6.2 kW heat loss is not too small so that shouldn't be a worry.
CEO and co-founder at HavenWise
@pie_eater welcome to the forums. If you have any Heat Geeks near you, it might be worth them coming out to do a survey too.
New to heat pumps? Take the Heat Pump Fundamentals course and use INTRO50 at checkout for 50% off.
Rewritten and updated for 2027
📘 From Zero to Heat Pump Hero
🛠️ Bodge Buster
🎧 Prefer to listen? Heat Pumps Explained
I did a review of the assumptions of the heat losses and a decent part of it is down to design temp, for Octopus and Aira they use 19 for hallways and bedrooms and 21 bathooms whereas the local company uses 21 everywhere and 22 for bathrooms.
My main question is, how inefficient would the LG 12KW be if heat losses turned out to be 6-7kw ? Would it cost me a lot extra per year or just marginal?
The installers seems to really like the LG 12KW, perhaps because of low noise. Not entirely sure why but he rattled of a range of unsuitable alternatives.
He tells me not to worry it will modulate down as its "inverter driven"
The trouble with heat pumps manufacturer use different criteria for naming the heat pump size. So for actual sizing you need to look at running curves and data.
We spend a very small fraction of the heating season at or below the design heat loss, and a lot at about 6-7 degs which is generally half the heat load. So your 6kW is really nearly 3kW most the year, plus DHW heating. I would allow 3 hrs for DHW heating.
So take you design heat loss of 6.4 and multiply by 24 that becomes 154kWh. Now due to DHW heating you only 21 hrs for house heating, 154 / 21 becomes 7.3kW. So you need a heat pump that can do 7.3kW at -3. But also turn down (min output) ideally to 3.2kW at 7 degs.
My house is a similar size but EPC A, our heat load is 3kW so with your B circa 6kW is way more realistic than 11kW.
Here is the link I mentioned, it contains various methods of calculating heat loss. It depends how accurate you want to go.
https://energy-stats.uk/what-size-heat-pump/
Using two very simple examples given:
The Heat Geek cheat sheet estimates your heat loss to be between 4.4 and 8.8 kW
Michael Podesta's quick and dirty method gives it as 4.7 kW (-3C OT to 21C IT) using your annual gas figure (assuming that is all heating and not hot water, it would be less if you use gas to heat you hot water).
I certainly would not consider a heat pump of more than 8kW for your property and might well be looking at one in the 5-6 kW range depending on how more detailed calculations come in.
As mentioned before, its important to double check the badged output on heat pumps as that can be misleading and also check how low they can modulate down, Im currently using about 2kW to heat my home (of similar heat loss) and Im starting to cycle.
House-3 bed partial stone bungalow, 5kW Samsung Gen 6 ASHP (Self install)
6.9 kWp of PV
10kWh DC coupled battery
Blog: https://thegreeningofrosecottage.weebly.com/
Heatpump Stats: http://heatpumpmonitor.org/system/view?id=60
@pie_eater LOL, you are going to love this forum then! 🤣
House-3 bed partial stone bungalow, 5kW Samsung Gen 6 ASHP (Self install)
6.9 kWp of PV
10kWh DC coupled battery
Blog: https://thegreeningofrosecottage.weebly.com/
Heatpump Stats: http://heatpumpmonitor.org/system/view?id=60
Each installer/designer can have their own idiocies
one wouldnt count our cavity wall insulation because we couldn’t prove it was still working after 40 years (of course not!) so said we needed a12kW Midea NO!
Another used default air leakage despite us having a pressure door test result (said MCS insisted) so recommended a 12kW Daikin NO
I’ve used both heatpunk https://heatpunk.co.uk/loggedout and PHPP and my own spreadsheet and it comes out as ~7kW HP needed (yep nerd!)
That corresponds with Podesta rule of thumb well (see link from energy stats above) with our gas usage.
If you ran your gas continuously at the lowest possible temperature you could be sure the gas usage would correspond well.
A heat geek guy did agree that 7kW is what we needed, but even he had to play around with the software since our MVHR system could only be included if the house was built after 2006. Wierd! So that came out as the 7kW Vaillant, so guess which installer we’re going with?
2kW + Growatt & 4kW +Sunnyboy PV on south-facing roof Solar thermal. 9.5kWh Givenergy battery with AC3. MVHR. Vaillant 7kW ASHP (very pleased with SCOP >4) open system operating on WC
- 26 Forums
- 2,725 Topics
- 63.8 K Posts
- 1,379 Online
- 7,126 Members
Join Us!
Installer Finder
Degrees of Separation
Latest Posts
-
RE: Jokes and fun posts about heat pumps and renewables
@transparent I’ve heard that that is why American cars ...
By Toodles , 1 hour ago
-
RE: HeatGeek vs Octopus surveys: puzzling disparity - any ideas why?
Have either quote provided room by room heat loss calcu...
By Old_Scientist , 15 hours ago
-
RE: Heat Pump Servicing & Maintenance – Good Value or Rip-Off?
@old_scientist if you are going DIY then you may wan...
By Papahuhu , 2 days ago
-
RE: Indevolt Batteries UK Support & Info Thread
After a short while that was followed by the 'power war...
By JamesPa , 2 days ago
-
RE: Samsung heat pump - data cable issue
That's well done. Cable is the correct type (LIYCY = 2x...
By bobflux , 2 days ago
-
RE: Electricity price predictions
I agree, we will find out at the next budget whether th...
By Old_Scientist , 3 days ago
-
RE: Missing flow temperature in Heat Geek proposal
@editor I went through HG website, so should be ok for ...
By sttpd1917 , 3 days ago
-
Who did the Freedom Heat Pump cloud server and what did...
By Mars , 3 days ago
-
RE: Who's your electricity provider and what's your tariff?
Reading between the lines of what octopus are doing wit...
By JamesPa , 3 days ago
-
RE: Air to air bus grant installer anywhere
The through wall two hole ones have their place (listed...
By EtchedPixels , 3 days ago
-
I hope it goes ok, Hon can be hard to set up IF the sof...
By Graham Hendra , 3 days ago
-
@clockworks Hi, So there is a big difference between st...
By ASHP-BOBBA , 3 days ago
-
@editor wellvery comprehensive answer. I will get all i...
By Keithb , 3 days ago
-
RE: Advice on my Heat Pump Journey: Old Stone Built Detached Cottage
all good advice I will follow this up
By PaulC , 3 days ago
-
Heat of vaporization of water is 2.25 MJ/kg (0.625 kWh/...
By bobflux , 4 days ago





