Joining the Renewable Heating Hub forums is completely free and only takes a minute. By registering you’ll be able to ask questions, join discussions, follow topics you’re interested in, bookmark useful threads and receive notifications when someone replies. Non-registered members also do not have access to our AI features. When choosing your username, please note that it cannot be changed later, so we recommend avoiding brand or product names. Before registering, please take a moment to read the Forum Rules & Terms of Use so we can keep the community helpful, respectful and informative for everyone. Thanks for joining!
5 Star Service from Havenwise
Hi both!
Appreciate the question. It's a good one.
Firstly, you're right that we have started experimenting with Facebook ads in the last few weeks. It's something new for us, so we're testing different things, wordings, visuals, etc. The whole process is an experiment and we're working with some external partners on this who create and manage the campaigns. They can get quite creative as you can imagine!
Secondly, on the claims then. This is not an easy one. And honestly something we are continuously talking about internally. The challenge is "What is the baseline?", and every house / user is different. The 40% that you see on our website is indeed versus a gas boiler. We chose that baseline back then because most people come from a boiler when they get a heat pump. The 40% is the average we were seeing across all our users at the time, meaning some people save more and some people save less.
If you do the math, a boiler with gas standing charge roughly costs the same as an "average" heat pump on a flat tariff. So you could argue that our users on average save 40% versus an "average" heat pump in the UK.
Averages are limited of course and I understand the gaps in them. The ultimate comparison would be comparing to a heat pump prior to Havenwise. But heat pump A can be a heat pump from a very advanced user who has written their own Home Assistant code. And heat pump B can be an ECO4 install on a weather curve that has been set much too high with 3rd party stats. Very different baseline, therefore Havenwise would lead to different savings in those setups.
And what do you do if it's a new heat pump which has just been installed?
And what if this winter is much warmer or colder than last winter?
And what if the user behaviour has changed because a child was born or an extension was added?
And what if the user changed tariffs?
Etc.
You can see it's getting complicated very quickly! All to say it's something we're aware of and we haven't cracked yet ourselves in all honesty. More work to be done on this.
CEO and co-founder at HavenWise
Totally agree, @hcas.
I think there's a bit of a conflict, though. As you will have seen on this very forum, you now have quite a well-established reputation for up-front open and honest dealing, but that advert does nothing to burnish that. Speaking purely as a customer, I'd far rather you compete on reputation rather than price. I realise, of course, that that's difficult when a big saving is a natural attention-grabber, but I wonder if you could publicise a limited set of comparison scenarios rather than just one "benchmark" comparison e.g.:
- If your heat pump's controlled by thermostats Havenwise might save circa £xyz
- If your heat pump's set up well but you're on a fixed leccy tariff, Havenwise might save circa £xyz
- If your heat pump's set up well and you're already on a TOU tariff, Havenwise might still be able to shave £xyz off your bill.
Dreadful wording, but you get the idea. Still showing the benefit but, by comparing like with like, being straight with people.
105 m2 bungalow in South East England
Mitsubishi Ecodan 8.5 kW air source heat pump
18 x 360W solar panels
1 x 6 kW GroWatt battery and SPH5000 inverter
1 x Myenergi Zappi
1 x VW ID3
Raised beds for home-grown veg and chickens for eggs
"Semper in excretia; sumus solum profundum variat"
@hcas majordennis is on the money for me in terms of what I'd expect to see when you are making claims of savings of 40, 50% etc. Would be much clearer and the last thing customers need in this industry is more smoke and mirrors.
@majordennisbloodnok and @benson Good suggestion! We'll look into that. Might take a little bit of time (busy season) but I agree we need to address that. Not only us, but industry-wide I think.
CEO and co-founder at HavenWise
- 27 Forums
- 2,782 Topics
- 65.6 K Posts
- 810 Online
- 7,187 Members
Join Us!
Installer Finder
Degrees of Separation
Latest Posts
-
RE: Tesla Powerwall (2) Calibration Cycles
@papahuhu Likewise, the main ‘extra’ relates to TOU tar...
By Toodles , 2 hours ago
-
How should the Boiler Upgrade Scheme be reformed?
The Boiler Upgrade Scheme (BUS) is essential in encoura...
By Rob of York , 4 hours ago
-
RE: Replacing Storage Heaters with a Heat Pump in a Stone Cottage
That sounds like a better approach (being able to see a...
By cathodeRay , 1 day ago
-
RE: DIY Heat Pump Installations: Navigating Legal and Regulatory Hurdles
Thanks for the reference @jamespa I can't see any te...
By Transparent , 1 day ago
-
RE: battery storage without solar
Indeed, current on the grid input = current used for ch...
By bobflux , 1 day ago
-
RE: Who's your electricity provider and what's your tariff?
@papahuhu @papahuhu A lot of tears and sweat went into ...
By Andris , 1 day ago
-
RE: Getting closer to a finished Haier system
Very nice! Congratulations. Big MLC looks neat whe...
By bobflux , 1 day ago
-
RE: Solar Power Output – Let’s Compare Generation Figures
We have the same problem, 12 mature trees clip the morn...
By Papahuhu , 2 days ago
-
RE: Solis inverters S6-EH1P: pros and cons and battery options
I had a battery and inverter installed a while ago, my ...
By Batpred , 2 days ago
-
RE: Is This Initial Free Quote From Octopus Trusted Partner Reasonable?
@ltron2 The EPC on our house is A-92, however that i...
By Rob of York , 2 days ago
-
RE: Heat pump branding. Clever, contemporary… or a bit too much?
The layout is confusing - much better like this: We b...
By downfield , 3 days ago
-
RE: Is it just me, or does tradesperson timekeeping and communication drive you absolutely mad?
My experience, backed up by opinions from various frien...
By Majordennisbloodnok , 3 days ago
-
RE: Analysis of the economics of switching to an A2W ASHP compared to other heat sources
I had a meeting today with a company based out of Swede...
By Mars , 4 days ago
-
RE: Review your electricity provider
We were with Octopus in our old house and it was fault...
By ian33a , 4 days ago





