Interesting "real world?" usage cost figures from 1000 Octopus Energy heat pump owners.

Comparing different COP and standard vs agile tariff.

https://octopus.energy/blog/heat-pump-running-costs/

How many here have tried the agile tariffs for their ashp? 

Posted by: @jeff

Interesting "real world?" usage cost figures from 1000 Octopus Energy heat pump owners.

Comparing different COP and standard vs agile tariff.

https://octopus.energy/blog/heat-pump-running-costs/

How many here have tried the agile tariffs for their ashp? 

Hi Jeff,

It would appear that Aimee has some really powerful 'rose tinted' glasses. Looking at the Octopus Agile (Yorkshire) tariff for today, the cheapest 0.5 hour period was 20.29p / kWh from 14:30 to 15:00. For 7 of the 24 hours the unit rate is at the maximum 35p / kWh, so I doubt that there will be many people still on the Agile tariff. Tomorrows cheapest rate is 22.68p / kWh from 02:30 to 03:00.

Her suggestion that it would be possible to operate an ASHP predominantly when the tariff is lowest, takes no account of the heat demand of a home, and the efficiency to be expected from an ASHP operating at lower ambient air temperatures. For an ASHP based system to come close to the higher efficiencies quoted in the article, would required UFH or high output radiators, along with continuous operation at low water flow temperatures, none of which appears to have been mentioned.

The article would appear to have been written in some Utopian world, not the real one.

Yes, the analysis was done using figures from December 2020-April 2021.  The rate used was 13.27p/kWh.  It wasn't even that cheap then; my weighted average for that period when I was on E7 was less than 9p. As @derek-m says Agile is way more than that now.

You can see for yourself here.

https://dashboards.energy-stats.uk/d/y9iWNjZMz/user-dashboard?orgId=1

The fairest comparison would be to use the Ofgem capped rates.  It's not quite as easy as a rates table but this calculator lets you work it the cap for your area and usage.  Electricity is about 5 x gas at the moment per kWh 😮 😮 

https://r6fd51uoetngaqh-db202106081427.adb.uk-london-1.oraclecloudapps.com/ords/r/apex_live/energy-price-calculator/home?session=113097265838215

Posted by: @kev-m

Electricity is about 5 x gas at the moment per kWh

@kev-m

If that doesn’t change very soon then surely the hopes for the governments carbon targets is an absolute non starter.

@morgan, unless ASHP become 5 times as efficient as gas then it is going to be an uphill battle with that difference. I don't know if the next price cap change will alter it. 

@kev-m Its one of the reasons I am moving to Octopus Go - the 5p/kw at night for 4 hours means I can preheat my house (in the rooms I am not sleeping) and lower my use in the day. Also I can fill my solar batteries to use that 5p energy. At worst case 2 COP it will still be 2.5p/kw of heat, so less than gas.

The biggest question is, how long will Octopus Go last? I feel like its a loss leader and few people have it - so they'll keep it

@batalto, I would have gone for the same but you need a smart meter, which I don't have.  Once the dust settles after the present turmoil I'll look at switching if it's still available.  The problem for me is that Octopus standard rates are a lot more expensive. 

Posted by: @batalto

@kev-m Its one of the reasons I am moving to Octopus Go - the 5p/kw at night for 4 hours means I can preheat my house (in the rooms I am not sleeping) and lower my use in the day. Also I can fill my solar batteries to use that 5p energy. At worst case 2 COP it will still be 2.5p/kw of heat, so less than gas.

The biggest question is, how long will Octopus Go last? I feel like its a loss leader and few people have it - so they'll keep it

Hi Batalto,

I hope that I am wrong for your sake, but I suspect Octopus will be reluctant to take on any new Go customers at the moment, even if they do not scrap the tariff altogether. The lowest overnight Agile tariff today was 22.68p / kWh, and there was still gas fired generation required to meet demand when it was at its lowest.

I was informed on Sunday that Octopus have been selected to take over my gas and electricity supply from Avro, though as yet I don't have details of the tariff they intend to offer, hopefully not Agile. Apparently I can switch to another supplier without incurring any penalty if I am not happy with what they offer. It also stated that the balance on my account would be moved from Avro to Octopus, so I should not need to chase anyone.

@kev-m I am just on the normal tariff at the moment - 17.8p until 2023. So not the end of the world. Smart meter goes in on the 11th of October

@derek-m luckily I started the application months ago, so I am already on my way to being switched. They accepted the switch so it should be locked in. Worst case I stay on the tariff I am currently on

Just looked, on my old numbers (e.g. sans heat pump) my combined gas/elec bill would be £1,900 and for ASHP only it would be £1,379.

For Octopus Go I am expecting around £700-800 for the year. Even without the saving from GO, I would be better off without gas due to the amount we used.

NOTE: Assumed SCOP is 2.8

@batalto, sounds good.  

It's hard to compare for me; it's going to be similar £ to my storage heaters but my electricity is now 16.5p/kWh compared with my 7.6p E7 rate last year.

Posted by: @kev-m

@morgan, unless ASHP become 5 times as efficient as gas then it is going to be an uphill battle with that difference. I don't know if the next price cap change will alter it. 

The current fixed rate tariffs on offer which are not limited by the price cap are still showing electricity around 5 times the price of gas so currently nothing to show the difference will change without further government intervention. 

Of course the upcoming government Heat and Building Strategy and the October budget may force some changes in the price of both gas and electricity at the next cap review. 

I am currently paying 15.3 for electricity and 2.75 for gas until my current fixed rate comes to an end so electric is 5.56 times gas for me.