My NIBE ASHP Nightmare: No Commissioning, High Bills and a Hostile Installer
Hello Forum.
Background. I am building a 150sqm bungalow using Passive House as a guide in Devon. Excellent thermal insulation. 0.9 ACH. Zender MVHR. NIBE F2040-12, SMO 20, Megacoil 300L. UFH from Wunda, Rapid Response (about 800 metres in 13 loops)
The system (ASHP)was installed in September 2025 by a NIBE accredited installer. I never received any commissioning paperwork or handover instructions. The installer is very difficult to deal with. I have been asking if the BUS Grant has been submitted, and for some adjustments to be made to my system. In a one sided phone call last week he launched into a vitriolic tirade that accused me (amongst other things) of being a trouble maker. I still have no paperwork. When I ordered the system, his website stated he was MCS accredited. He has since allowed this to lapse and is using an umbrella company. He refused to say whether the BUS Grant application has been submitted, and would not tell me the name of the umbrella company.
The installer did not complete any heat loss/heat load calculations, and as a result I now believe that at 12Kw the ASHP is oversized. At the time I was completely ignorant of the steps that should be taken prior to starting an installation. Judging by the number of comments on the forum this seems to be a common mistake.
My first utility bill showed a usage of approximately 600kwh. I asked my installer why it was so high. He felt that was ok for an “electric” house. Since I was unable persuade the installer to look at my system I decided I would have to learn how to adjust it myself. With the help of the Open Energy Monitor Forum, John Cantor’s book, the Ultimate Guide book, and many hours on YouTube I have a better understanding of how ASHP work and how they should integrate with UFH.
Changing my system settings by small increments at a time I have been ablet to reduce my power usage by approximately 50%. However, I believe that further savings are possible. A volumizer has been included in my system, but it doesn’t seem to have been installed as shown in the Installation Manual. Also, it is not in line with the information on this Forum. I would greatly appreciate it if members could look at the attached photograph, and schematic and post their conclusions.
Welcome to the forums @mike-camelot.
What you’ve described ticks all the worst boxes: no heat loss calculation, no commissioning paperwork, no handover, no clarity on the grant and an installer who won’t communicate professionally. That is absolutely not how this is supposed to work.
Under the MCS ‘standards’ (I use that term very loosely), the installer must complete and register the installation on the MCS database and issue you a certificate and full handover pack within about 10 working days of commissioning including all compliance and warranty documents. You should have had this long before now.
Similarly, if the installer is no longer MCS-accredited and has shifted to an umbrella scheme without telling you, that’s still their responsibility to disclose and complete the paperwork correctly… the umbrella company assumes full contractual and certification responsibility for the job. The fact they won’t even tell you who that company is is highly problematic.
If you don’t want to name the installer publicly, please email me an I’ll look into them.
Your utility bill and your own adjustments clearly show someone who is thinking like an engineer and you’re absolutely right to dig in yourself. A heat pump system in a well-insulated passive build shouldn’t produce bills like that, and the absence of a proper commissioning report means the controls, flow temps and volumiser configuration weren’t verified objectively against a design.
Once I have the installer name I’ll offer you more advice.
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Ditto that for Building Regulations @mike-camelot
Installation of a heating system falls under Part-L of the Building Regs,
and Section-9 too
The obligation to confirm that your installation complies with Part-L rests with your Local Planning Authority.
The Councillor(s) for your ward need to know that the system isn't working as it should.
Who is your LPA?
I thought Camelot was in Cornwall?
PS Just looking at your photo:
Is that a SIP construction...
... with a Glulam beam on the right supporting a purlin?
Save energy... recycle electrons!
My family name is Arthur. The sailboat that we lived on was Avalon (as in Isle of Avalon). Camelot became the house name. Just a bit of fun.
The LPA is East Devon. I had a "private" Building Control inspector (Assent). As I was approaching the final inspection, in November, Assent went into liquidation with 2 days notice. I had to revert to the LPA and they insisted on charging for a full inspection schedule. I was told that Assent had 17,000 clients throughout England so I imagine it has presented LPA with a problem. I just had my initial Building Control inspection last week. I have asked the installer for the required paperwork on several occasions with no result. I can tell you the stress has not been fun.
The regulations that you presented are very interesting. I wish I knew how I could get the installer to produce the required paperwork. Based on previous encounters he will either just put down the phone or start with another tirade about me being a trouble maker.
Yes. It is a full SIP construction. The structural engineer went a bit "over the top" with the beams. In the UK there has been almost no testing of SIP construction, so engineers add a bit, no a lot, to be safe. In the USA they have been building SIP houses for over 60 years and have a wealth of knowledge.
Any thoughts on the volumiser installation?
In the diagram the volumiser is shown as being between flow and return thus acting as a short circuit for the water flow. This is wrong, it should either be in the flow or in the return, preferably the flow but it's not super critical. I can't tell from the picture how it has been plumbed but, if it's per the diagram, it needs to be replumbed. Fortunately that's quite easy except for the draining down and refilling. Hopefully there are some isolation valves so you don't have to drain the the whole system or a plumber may be able to freeze the pipes whilst it's done.
12kW for a modern house is crazy unless it's 400sq m plus or a very odd shape. Your heat pump will most likely cycle rather more than is desirable. If you have a big slab on the other hand you may be able to take advantage by batch heating on cheap rate, essentially treating the slab like a storage heater.
What period was 600kWh for. My December consumption (heat pump only) was 650kWh, house loss 7kW
4kW peak of solar PV since 2011; EV and a 1930s house which has been partially renovated to improve its efficiency. 7kW Vaillant heat pump.
Volumisers were discussed here in great detail in this topic with diagrams
That link takes you straight to the graphics on page-3, but you'll probably want to return to start in order to appreciate the context.
I hadn't realised that Assent had gone into liquidation.
When you say that you've reverted to the LPA, is that using Devon Building Control ?
I didn't think any of the LPAs in Devon had retained their own Building Control surveyors.
Although I too am in Devon, I don't have any direct communications with East Devon District Council.
But you really should email your LPA ward Councillor(s).
Either your installer has notified then (falsely) that your installation complies, or he's omitted to do so.
Neither situation is satisfactory.
I am aware of your Council representation at County level, however.
A DCC Councillor from an East Devon ward visited my home last weekend to discuss energy issues and look at my storage battery test-rig. 🙂
That was a 3-hour meeting!
Irrespective of the manner of your previous phone conversations with the installer, I would recommend that you send him an email to set out the situation.
You are likely to need evidence of your complaint(s) and what response they receive.
The date/time stamp on emails will suffice.
You have an option to bring a claim for redress under the Consumer Rights Act (2015).
This operates through your local Citizens Advice Bureau, rather than the Small Claims Division of the High Court.
The Act covers both physical goods and services.
This discussion topic also provides part of the evidence which you need to tell Citizens Advice about.
I am already talking with other Councillors about the possible use of SIP construction to meet housing targets in yet another area of Devon.
The strategy lends itself to self-build, which means they would only be a possible home for local people.
No Council likes having to rely on the big national housing developers to meet targets, because they end up with a paltry percentage of 'Affordable Housing'.
Self-build SIPs are an attractive alternative.
Save energy... recycle electrons!
Posted by: @mike-camelotThe structural engineer went a bit "over the top" with the beams. In the UK there has been almost no testing of SIP construction, so engineers add a bit, no a lot, to be safe.
When I wanted glulam beams for my farmhouse restoration/extension, I used Lamisell near Okehampton.
Their own specification engineer phoned from Holland, and amended the sizes I'd suggested.
That advice was accepted by Building Control, who were happy with what I then installed.
No, I didn't use a main contractor.
This is hands-on self-build work!
I've found it's still possible to get Building Control sign-off and insurance without needing to risk using a 3rd party.
Save energy... recycle electrons!
That's exactly what I thought. I was looking for confirmation. The NIBE installation manual offers 3 different methods, but I believe you are right based on the reason that a volomisier is fitted. With the volume that I have in UFH I don't even think that it would be necessary.
Yes, East Devon have their own Building Control. Fortunately I have kept a very complete photographic georeferenced, time stamped record of the build. I m hoping that I don't fall foul of some overlooked regulation
I am ging to make one last attempt to get the installer to provide the paperwork. In the meantime I will find out who is the ward Councillor for EX14 3PJ. He was at our last annual meeting, but his name escapes me at the moment. I fairly sure that formalising a compliant will start a very unpleasant chain of events.
If you would like to visit my build I'm sure there must be a way you can PM me.
I replied to "transparent" about the volumiser. It is as per the drawing. I would dearly like to re-plumb the system but it will have to wait until I have been able to conclude some arrangement with my installer. I have already asked him if it was correctly installed and his reply was "what are you now, a heating engineer"?!! End of discussion. I have significantly researched volumisers and I suspect that it is not required with my system due to the quite large volume in my UFH. It certainly would not do any harm to have it plumbed correctly. Since it is a new system I will need to get either the installer to agree or at the very least get confirmation from the manufacturer that I can alter the layout, otherwise the warranty may be invalidated.
Since there were NO heat loss calculations before the system was installed I have no idea how the installer arrived at 12Kwh. My total house consumption for December was 934Kwh. I estimate that my usage other than heat pump is about 300Kwh. Cooking, lighting, sewage treatment pump, MVHR etc. etc. I want to install a load meter on the pump. Just haven't had the time to get round to it. Unfortunately the Open Energy Monitor systems are out of stock. I'm open to suggestions.
I am still on the standard tariff with Octopus. I wanted to fully understand the operating system before I selected another tariff.
I am also looking for a program that can help with carrying out a Heat Loss Survey.
Mike - You have two District Councillors for your ward:
Go to this page and you'll be able to find their email addresses.
Councillor Cathy Connor is representative at County level, and doesn't need to be involved at this stage.
Of particular interest is that I see East Devon District Council has appointed Cllr Dan Ledger (Seaton) as Portfolio Holder Sustainable Homes & Communities.
He could be a very useful contact.
Remember, you're not raising a complaint with the District Council.
You're 'on the same side'.
You are informing them that:
a. There is a deficiency in the MCS approved process for installation of heat-pumps in that accredited Installers are self-certifying work.
The Council is therefore issuing letters of confirmation to householders which inform them of the system's compliance with the regulations,
despite a proportion of those properties having had work done which breaches the Building Regs.
b. You wish to check whether the District Council has been informed of the work at your home by the Installer within the timeframes given
in Sections 8 & 9 of Part-L.
The Councillors need not concern themselves with the technical issues, which will be a relief to them!
Firstly you have already got a job number with their Building Control Dept
Secondly, the Forum Members here can advise on anything technical.
Save energy... recycle electrons!
Posted by: @mike-camelotI replied to "transparent" about the volumiser. It is as per the drawing. I would dearly like to re-plumb the system but it will have to wait until I have been able to conclude some arrangement with my installer. I have already asked him if it was correctly installed and his reply was "what are you now, a heating engineer"?!! End of discussion. I have significantly researched volumisers and I suspect that it is not required with my system due to the quite large volume in my UFH. It certainly would not do any harm to have it plumbed correctly. Since it is a new system I will need to get either the installer to agree or at the very least get confirmation from the manufacturer that I can alter the layout, otherwise the warranty may be invalidated.
Noted and dilemma understood. A volumiser may not be needed but it wont do any harm if its plumbed correctly. As it is, its a 2 port buffer and may cause mixing between flow and return*, which may, but not absolutely certain, to be harmful to performance depending on how it (and in particular the secondary pump) is set up.
If you have the wherewithal, measure pipe temperatures on the flow before and after. If they are the same (and close to the ASHPs value for FT) then it probably isn't causing significant harm. If the temperature after is lower than the temperature before then it is costing 2-3% per degree of difference.
Re the snide comment, obviously your installer isn't a (competent) heating engineer or doesn't understand customer service. If he were/did then he would have the courtesy/be able to explain what he had done and why, rather than resulting to insults. In this case since the installation differs from the installation manual he has even more explaining to do!
Resulting to insult is, at least in my experience, the first defence of the incompetent tradesman, swiftly followed by 'its mandated by' (unspecified) 'regulations'. Poor sparkys are particularly prone to this, good ones can explain their reasoning and will, if asked, check and quote the regulation concerned.
Posted by: @mike-camelotSince there were NO heat loss calculations before the system was installed I have no idea how the installer arrived at 12kWwh. My total house consumption for December was 934Kwh. I estimate that my usage other than heat pump is about 300Kwh. Cooking, lighting, sewage treatment pump, MVHR etc. etc. I want to install a load meter on the pump. Just haven't had the time to get round to it. Unfortunately the Open Energy Monitor systems are out of stock. I'm open to suggestions.
OK so thats 600kWh for the heat pump, similar to mine in Dec and consistent with a loss of ~7kW if the heat pump is operating at a SCOP of 4. This is at least plausible (unlike 12kW) but still sounds a bit too high given your property description. suspect your actual loss is lower and your SCOP ditto.
MCS rules require a heat loss calculation to be done so he could reasonably be asked to show you his workings!
Posted by: @mike-camelotI am also looking for a program that can help with carrying out a Heat Loss Survey.
Heat Punk is often used and generally gets good reviews, although I cant personally vouch for it. I did my own spreadsheet so I knew what was going on, but thats just me. Unfortunately they only help with the calculation, You still need to know size of rooms. fabric etc. However as you have just done a refurb I imagine you do.
Hope that helps
* I should declare that we haven't yet had a full debate on this forum about 2 port buffers, which are relatively unusual. Most of the debate has been about 4 and occasionally 3 port ones. Its clear that they have the potential to 'short circuit' your emitters which does some limited harm, its less clear the extent to which they have the potential to reduce flow temperature to the emitters, which does more harm.
By the same token there has been no justification or coherent explanation put forward for them (over a volumiser) by anyone, whether from the trade or otherwise. Thus I am suspicious, open to being convinced otherwise by someone with a coherent explanation (but not by insults!), but cant see any reason to take the risk of fitting one when a volumiser is a known solution with no ill side effects to the problem of insufficient or marginal system volume. Occam's razor is generally a good principle to apply to heat pump systems.
4kW peak of solar PV since 2011; EV and a 1930s house which has been partially renovated to improve its efficiency. 7kW Vaillant heat pump.
Posted by: @mike-camelotI am also looking for a program that can help with carrying out a Heat Loss Survey.
In addition to @jamespa’s suggestion of Heat Punk, Heat Engineer, whose software I have seen in action, allows homeowners to use it for free.
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