Posted by: @freezingeastsussex

Hi there,

Recently bought a bungalow in a village. There is no heating system installed at all, we think they previously had storage heaters but these are now long gone.

We are currently installing a 5kw log burner, which will definitely help but we also need a heating system.
The village is not connected to mains gas, but we want to future proof the property and be as green as we can whilst also staying warm anyway.

We are at the early stages of looking into an ASHP, I’m a little frightened after reading people’s reviews on the internet. Can they really keep a two bedroom property warm and provide plenty of hot water for showers?! The property is 700sqm, has cavity wall insulation, double glazing and we are putting in more loft insulation.

Any advice for someone in the early stages of this and reassurance would be great! 
Thank you 😊 

Hi and welcome to the forum.

Yes and yes.  We also bought a bungalow in a village with no gas. We removed the storage heaters and and happy with our ASHP.  

I assume you mean 70m2? Or maybe 700ft2?. 700m2 would be a big house!!

It sounds like an ASHP would work fine for you.  What is the heating and HW requirement from your EPC?  

The biggest problem you may have is finding a decent supplier but look around and get some quotes. 

Hi, @FreezingEastSussex, and welcome. The short answer to your question is yes. A properly spec’d and installed ASHP is perfectly capable of heating your house and hot water. More pertinent, of course, is how to achieve that. We’re relative newbies, having only had ours for about 2 months, but that’s already long enough to convince me of several things.

1. Preparation is important, and work done improving your insulation will pay massive dividends; the most efficient heating system imagineable heating a draughty house is still going to waste lots of energy. We got a cheap thermal camera to spot our culprits and the results were immediately obvious.
2. Finding a good installer is critical. Don’t even consider anyone who isn’t MCS accredited, and try to spot the companies who are actually listening to what you want; someone who sells what you need rather than what they want you to have. As it happens, our installer covers your area, so is at least worth talking to.
3. If you can possibly stretch to it, installing a solar pv array with battery is well worth considering. Even if you only got the battery, it can be recharged at night, meaning much of your ASHP consumption immediately costs night time rate rather than full day rate. In this current climate, that’s a big consideration.

What an ASHP is not so good at is quick changes in temperature. Your log burner will be ideal to cover that gap, so you seem to have all the key points covered. Good luck and let us know how you get on.

@freezingeastsussex, welcome to the forums. While there are a lot of bad reviews of ASHPs around, heat pumps definitely do work (and work very well) provided that the systems are designed and installed properly.

You mentioned there's no heating in this house, so I assume that there are no radiators. If that's the case, and you'll be fitting them as part of the project, you'll have the bonus of fitting rads that will work better with low flow rate systems like heat pumps.

You also have the option of going with an air-to-air heat pump, which could be very interesting. If your property is 700sqm then that won't work, but if it is a 70sqm bungalow, that could be a very smart and easy solution to your heating which you have up and running in a very short period of time. 

Posted by: @majordennisbloodnok

Finding a good installer is critical. Don’t even consider anyone who isn’t MCS accredited, and try to spot the companies who are actually listening to what you want; someone who sells what you need rather than what they want you to have. As it happens, our installer covers your area, so is at least worth talking to.

 

This is by far the most important thing – it's not the kit that doesn't deliver. It's the way it's been planned, designed and installed. Finding competent heat pump installers is the biggest challenge facing the UK in the coming years – there are two many cowboy, bodge jobs that are tarnishing the industry and the technology. 

@editor 

we got a NIBE F2040 last winter. Our bills then were horrendous. We have a 4 bed house and got oversized radiator with the heat pump. It does work well and heats the house very effectively.

I have a question about how to efficiently run the system. We don’t have radiator thermostats and so we change them manually.We have the radiators turned down to minimum during the day then up in the evening and down at night again. Last 24 hrs despite turning everything off that we don’t need and running thermostats as above we used 53 units electricity.

do people use radiator thermostats and do they find that it helps them run the heat pump to lower costs?

@majordennisbloodnok 

Can you point in the direction of the "cheap thermal camera" please.  I've not seen a cheap one.

Posted by: @toml1981

@editor 

we got a NIBE F2040 last winter. Our bills then were horrendous. We have a 4 bed house and got oversized radiator with the heat pump. It does work well and heats the house very effectively.

I have a question about how to efficiently run the system. We don’t have radiator thermostats and so we change them manually.We have the radiators turned down to minimum during the day then up in the evening and down at night again. Last 24 hrs despite turning everything off that we don’t need and running thermostats as above we used 53 units electricity.

do people use radiator thermostats and do they find that it helps them run the heat pump to lower costs?

Hi Tom,

You are using your ASHP in completely the wrong manner, which is probably why you are using so much energy. Read the manual and set your system to operate in weather compensation mode or auto adaptation if that is available. Then open all your radiator valves fully and turn any thermostats to 1C above the desired temperature.

Regulate the indoor temperature using the Nibe controller, not by any thermostats. If there is anything about which you are not certain then ask.

@toml1981 I have a four bed house, obviously could be lots of other differences, but I’ve been running my system as Derek describes for the last two weeks and it’s made a big difference. I’ve been averaging just under 30 units of electricity per day for the last week (16-38kwh/day) and 24kwh  yesterday as it’s got a bit warmer. House stays at a steady 20-21c all the time. 
It is possible for a heat pump to heat a property efficiently but requires a change of mindset on house to heat the house I think, and for (some of) the installers to know this too. 

Posted by: @morgan

@majordennisbloodnok 

Can you point in the direction of the "cheap thermal camera" please.  I've not seen a cheap one.

I think I have to caveat my answer even before I start. Photography is a hobby of mine, so “cheap” and “camera” aren’t easy words to use in the same sentence at the best of times. My frame of reference may not be quite the same as everyone’s…..

However, there are several thermal cameras available at around £150-200 which are plenty for general home analysis. We got ours from Amazon, and although ours - from Seek - is no longer available, I reckon that cost was easy to justify in the context to the £15,000 on the ASHP and £7,500 on the solar pv. To be fair, we also lent our camera to several neighbours so they could do the same thing, so it’s certainly paid for itself.

@derek-m hi thanks for this. We do have our NIBE on auto which is the weather compensation mode. 

We don’t have radiator thermostats which from what you’re saying would help. And making sure the valve oh left side of radiator is open fully- if I understand you properly 

thanks

tom

@majordennisbloodnok Thanks for that Dennis.  I fully understand the caveat.  I was a togger in a past life.