@adamk it's probably filtering different providers in the backend. This is one of the reasons we stopped referrals and endorsements directly through the Heat Geek website because there's no transparency.

Got a heat loss on a room after I fitted a new rad and worried it’s too big. The heat loss says 385W at 21c but the rad I’ve put in is a 600mm h x 1200 w K2 which is 634W at dt20. Should I move it to another room where I need to put a bigger one and put a smaller one in here closer to the actual heat loss?

I’ve noticed my heating/hw circuit water pump seems to be running constantly, is this normal?

@adamk nope, not normal. I shouldn’t come on unless your system’s calling for heat. That’s the only time ours comes on, and when I hear it, I know it’s hearing. Check to see if your heat pump is on.

Definitely.

i had heat calcs for my rooms done, a small bedroom was assumed to be an office, so surveyor assumed 21C reqd temp. In operation, this rad warmed this room up quicker than others, and it looked too big for the room. So I swapped this with another room that was underperforming, both rooms now have similar warm up profiles 

@editor nope no heat demand and heat pump is off apart from this 25w aprox of circulation pump.

might try turning the HP heating side off on the controller. at the mo its on weather comp with a night setback of 2c so 20c down to 18c.

Posted by: @adamk

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@editor nope no heat demand and heat pump is off apart from this 25w aprox of circulation pump.

might try turning the HP heating side off on the controller. at the mo its on weather comp with a night setback of 2c so 20c down to 18c.

If it's running on WC then at night it's quite likely to heat up.  The outdoors gets quite cold at night! 

Likewise circulator pump is likely to continue running because many heat pumps simply run the circulator 24*7

If you want it off altogether then, as you say, switchimg heating off should do the trick.

as some of you may know ive been on a rather protracted journey to get a Vaillant heat pump. in the end i contacted Vaillant who managed to get a company that was one of the closest, still about 30 mile away, to do the install. that was about 2 months ago.

since then theyve had to come back once to essentially finish off and do a somewhat rushed commission, as the engineer didnt realise what had been left for him. they havent balanced the rads, though that side of the system is all my original rads and i didnt specifically ask for it on the quote, i just asked for a heat pump and new tank retro fitted to some new pipework my plumber fitted ready.

whilst the engineer wasnt fully happy with the flexi pipes to the heat pump it was the best they could do with the limited tools they had with them and they did at least seal the insulation up this time.

so i started to wonder about the flexi pipes as they are very stiff and not happy being bent 90deg in at both ends. i contacted primary pro for advice and sent some pics. it turns out these flexis are not supposed to be bent, the flex is just to remove vibrations between the heat pump and house pipe work. he sent me a 3D video of how they are supposed to be fitted. he said it is difficult for him to get involved with a dispute between the installer and end user as it could affect his business.

then whilst on facebook a post from the Vaillant group popped up where installers were grumbling about not being able to get hold of specific mcbs required for Vaillants. so curious i posted a pic of mine and it turns out theyre not correct either. so to double check i asked Vaillant tech support who confirmed they were incorrect.

so ive been back to the company about these issues and was told they would have trouble getting out to me as van problems etc. ok so left it a couple of weeks. asked for an update and silence for a couple of days. then Vaillant called to see how things were going and i explained the issues, they emailed the installer and ive now got them coming this Thursday, but they are only sorting the flexis. apparently they showed the pic to someone from Vaillant who said it was of with those mcbs. so back to Vaillant tech support, he said nope not correct the spec has been in place since 2023 and could i find out the name of the Vaillant employee so they could send them the internal documentation. so back to installer, who has basically said the will call the Vaillant system designer tech and argue with him.

is it any wonder so many heat pumps are installed incorrectly or not to spec. i dont think im being picky wanting at least the bit of my heating system ive paid £11300 (£7500 BUS is part of that) to be installed correctly? i dont want Vaillant or primary pro coming back to me, if i have to seek a warranty claim, after they take one look at the install and say not covered.

the company in question are Heat Geek Elite and Vaillant installer advanced.

@adamk what a shambles. Can you share some pics of the bent flexi pipes?

Posted by: @adamk

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then whilst on facebook a post from the Vaillant group popped up where installers were grumbling about not being able to get hold of specific mcbs required for Vaillants. so curious i posted a pic of mine and it turns out theyre not correct either. so to double check i asked Vaillant tech support who confirmed they were incorrect.

I think you probably mean RCDs rather than MCBs.  

Vaillant, in common with many heat pump manufactures, specify Type B RCDs which, unlike the more common Type A ones, detect residual DC current as well as residual AC, and thus protect against a wider range of faults.  I presume this is related to the inverter drive for the compressor.  If you have an older consumer unit (or a fuse box) the correct type may simply not be available to fit.  Some electricians will fit a secondary CU in this case to overcome the problem.

There is a very reasonable argument that Vaillant should just specify that it should be wired in accordance with the regulations applicable in the country of installation, as it really isn't their business to determine this, only to give the electrician the necessary parameters so that they can determine it.  I am told by one of the few electricians I trust to do what is required but not to over-egg, that the IET wiring regulations don't require RCDs at all for external fixed plant, only MCBs.  These don't detect residual current, only overcurrent, so offer much less protection either than Type A or B RCDs.  Of course not having protection against particular types of fault does make it less safe in certain rare fault conditions, but the probability of the condition occurring is low. 

That said there is a case reported on the HSE website where a contractor was killed by electrocution whilst inspecting a faulty aircon unit.  The newspaper report here   suggests that the electrocution was due to exposed live wires in the ceiling (presumably protected by neither a Type B nor a Type A RCD - which was quite probably in itself legal because RCDs are relatively recent and, in many circumstances, it is not mandatory to retrofit them to older installations).  The Council which owned the building was prosecuted because they knew of the danger and since the prosecution was successful it seems reasonable to assume that the contractor had isolated the feed to the unit in question.  RCD protection of the unit itself therefore wouldn't have helped!

I think the point of this is that you can reduce risk but not totally eliminate it and its a matter of risk management and regulation where the line lies.  I personally would worry about the flexis more than about the RCDs/MCBs, but of course that's a personal judgement

@adamk Hi Adam,

Oh my, in defence of all good ASHP installers I wanted to just say there are some very good companies out there and it is sad to hear about your experience. There is no confusion with regards to the type of electrical connection needed by Vaillant it very clear in their instructions and on the training (B type RCD so it can handle DC leakage with a C rated MCB/RCBO), although not requested by all other ASHP manufacturers yet it is recommended to use this type for all inverter driven or DC converting tech. we install this electrical circuit on all ASHP's.

Just to let you know FuseBox and most other manufacturers do these fuses, its the suppliers do not stock them to grab off the shelf, this is why engineers cant get them, they just cant get them on the day of install it takes 2 weeks to order them in, the solution to this is to stock them to cover the 3 main sizes or order them at point of order for a planned install 3 weeks away.

I wish you luck getting it all sorted. 

PS: yes its not good practise to bend flexi as the rubber tube inside the braiding can collapse and restrict the flow and it will also remove the anti-vibration value.

Posted by: @ashp-bobba

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Oh my, in defence of all good ASHP installers I wanted to just say there are some very good companies out there and it is sad to hear about your experience

Im glad you said this.  Its reasonable to suppose we get a distorted view on this forum and its important IMHO to be reminded of that from time to time.  People are only likely to join (a) in advance if the are feeling unsure and take an unusual level of interest in their heating system or (b) if they have had a problem. 

People who have a successful install and who just want to get on with their lives are likely to do just that!  

Posted by: @ashp-bobba

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Just to let you know FuseBox and most other manufacturers do these fuses, its the suppliers do not stock them to grab off the shelf, this is why engineers cant get them, they just cant get them on the day of install it takes 2 weeks to order them in, the solution to this is to stock them to cover the 3 main sizes or order them at point of order for a planned install 3 weeks away.

I have heard some argue that you shouldn't/cant/mustn't fit a RCD from manufacturer X into a CU from manufacturer Y even if they fit mechanically, and also argued that the instructions with the CU say this (which is entirely plausible, even if a bit silly).  If an installer follows this 'rule' then stocking 3 main sizes presumably wont guarantee a fit, the only solution is to survey in advance ... which surely is hardly difficult, just take a photo of the CU when doing the heat loss survey?

In the case of at least some older CUs (eg mine, and doubtless others) you simply cant get a type B RCD that fits.  At that point the electrician has to make a decision whether to follow the Vaillant rules or just stick to requirements of the IET regs.  She could potentially be criticised either way; if she follows the Vaillant rules then there is an extra cost involved for the householder which is not mandated by regulation; if she sticks with the IET rules then she hasn't followed the manufacturers instructions.  Since it is clear, so far as I can tell, that the Vaillant rules are merely Vaillant's take on safety trade offs (or alternatively covering their backsides), not something that actually affects the operation of the heat pump, there are customers who would probably prefer just doing the minimum. 

Should they be prevented from making this decision so long as it complies with IET rules, I personally would say that they should not.  Personally I would argue that installers and householders should generally be free to solve practical problems that inevitably arise how they choose, so long as long as it both complies with regulations and doesn't materially affect operation.  By being too prescriptive we risk introducing unnecessary cost and disruption.

Of course she is (sadly) probably he in reality, but the same applies.