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Single vs. three phase for heat pump, EV and appliances

 
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Electricity, Tariffs, Monitoring & Providers
Last Post by David999 1 year ago
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 Anonymous 5011
(@Anonymous 5011)
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 563
29/08/2024 1:17 pm  

Never understood the need for three phase in a domestic situation. Even with an electric car, you charge slowly overnight doesn't need rapid charge.



   
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 GunboatDiplomat
(@gunboatdiplomat)
Estimable Member Member
Joined: 1 year ago
Posts: 40
29/08/2024 1:57 pm  

Larger heat pumps, heated pools, steam rooms and hot tubs in top of a normal domestic load were examples that came up today. I had a three phase supply in my childhood home but that was because we had a kiln - so not a normal domestic load!



   
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 Derek M
(@derek-m)
Illustrious Member Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 4427
29/08/2024 2:14 pm  

Posted by: @gunboatdiplomat
↑

Larger heat pumps, heated pools, steam rooms and hot tubs in top of a normal domestic load were examples that came up today. I had a three phase supply in my childhood home but that was because we had a kiln - so not a normal domestic load!

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I was under the impression that the objective was to save our planet from global warming by using LESS energy.

 



   
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Toodles
 Toodles
(@toodles)
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Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 2151
29/08/2024 2:29 pm  

@derek-m Certainly less ‘dirty’ energy anyway! Toodles.


Toodles, heats his home with cold draughts and cooks food with magnets.


   
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 Anonymous 5011
(@Anonymous 5011)
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 563
29/08/2024 2:41 pm  

Posted by: @gunboatdiplomat
↑

childhood home

Mine had coal fire, doesn't mean I would have one now.

If your home is listed as grade 1 then you have a plausible excuse for a very large heat pump, otherwise get more insulation, reduced drafts.

Pools should be heated by a heat pump, so they can be very small anyway.

So still see no need for 3 phase.

 



   
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 Derek M
(@derek-m)
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Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 4427
29/08/2024 2:42 pm  

Posted by: @toodles
↑

@derek-m Certainly less ‘dirty’ energy anyway! Toodles.

I suppose that is okay then.

 



   
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Toodles
 Toodles
(@toodles)
Illustrious Member Contributor
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 2151
29/08/2024 3:18 pm  

@derek-m Well, preferably no dirty energy and only as much clean energy as might be justified. As the King who had to cut down on his staff is reputed to have said ‘Can’t a King have a biscuit?😉 Toodles.


Toodles, heats his home with cold draughts and cooks food with magnets.


   
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 Mike Patrick
(@mike-patrick)
Honorable Member Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 180
30/08/2024 11:50 am  

@derek-m That''s the irony of electric vehicles isn't it? Being heavier than ICE ones they need more energy to move around. The extra energy needs to be from renewable sources for them to make sense.

 

Mike


Grant Aerona HPID10 10kWh ASHP


   
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Toodles
 Toodles
(@toodles)
Illustrious Member Contributor
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 2151
30/08/2024 12:14 pm  

@mike-patrick I think the 745.7 watts of renewable energy required for the electric vehicle is probably a more efficient horsepower than one derived from a probably less efficient ICE in a vehicle? (What I’m trying to say is: I don’t know the efficiency of an ICE!) Regards, Toodles


Toodles, heats his home with cold draughts and cooks food with magnets.


   
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Majordennisbloodnok
 Majordennisbloodnok
(@majordennisbloodnok)
Famed Member Moderator
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 962
31/08/2024 8:01 am  

Very roughly speaking, a modern ICE vehicle is up to about 25% efficient whilst a comparable EV is about 75% efficient. The EV then has an extra complication that there are losses of between 5 and 10% in the charging process itself, but that still makes for a hugely more energy efficient vehicle despite the heavier weight.


105 m2 bungalow in South East England
Mitsubishi Ecodan 8.5 kW air source heat pump
18 x 360W solar panels
1 x 6 kW GroWatt battery and SPH5000 inverter
1 x Myenergi Zappi
1 x VW ID3
Raised beds for home-grown veg and chickens for eggs

"Semper in excretia; sumus solum profundum variat"


   
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Toodles
 Toodles
(@toodles)
Illustrious Member Contributor
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 2151
31/08/2024 9:45 am  

@majordennisbloodnok Thank you for confirming my thoughts Major. Regards, Toodle.


Toodles, heats his home with cold draughts and cooks food with magnets.


   
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bontwoody
 bontwoody
(@bontwoody)
Noble Member Contributor
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 892
31/08/2024 11:36 am  

@mike-patrick Actually Mike, my BMW i3 is lighter than an equivalent ICE car, much to my friends annoyance when he was trying make a point about EV weights, so its not a given.

However the real advantage of EVs over ICEs is regenerative breaking where most of the energy that is just lost in slowing down an ICE is recouped back into the battery in an EV.

That is a major area where EVs increase their efficiency over ICEs as well as in the conversion process where ICEs are very poor efficiency.


House-2 bed partial stone bungalow, 5kW Samsung Gen 6 ASHP (Self install)
6.9 kWp of PV
5kWh DC coupled battery
Blog: https://thegreeningofrosecottage.weebly.com/
Heatpump Stats: http://heatpumpmonitor.org/system/view?id=60


   
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