Posted by: @keithh

Hello all 

This seems to be a great group of people who understand ASHP and other items 

The issue I am having is finding some one to even quote to fit a unit 

I have sent many enquiries but get no response due to the complex nature of our property 

We are hoping to have a ASHP installed and know we need to change some radiators and pipe work due to age and size 

We are also asking for the system to be zoned by using new type TRV valves and smart hubs 

so can anyone recommend any good installers in the Daventry /Northamptonshire area who might want to quote 

Many thanks Keith  

Hi Keith,

Welcome to the forum.

Have you tried asking Boris Johnson, he plans to get 600,000 heat pumps installed each year? 😋 

There may be someone on the forum who can help, but before going down the zoning, TRV's and smart hubs route, I would suggest that you read through some of the posts concerning efficient operation of ASHP based systems.

@derek-m 

Many thanks i have done a lot of research for our project and as we live in a old large house we have a lot of rooms we dont need to heat all the time so this is why i am looking at trying to get the newest tech linked to the system 

Also we are trying to get two smaller units rather than one large unit to help control running costs 

As I say I know our install is not straight forward but as with all expensive purchases have done a lot of research first to try and get a system installed which works correctly first time hopefully 

As a lot of posts seem to be saying that their systems take a lot of call outs to get working right 

So I look forward to any help please 

Thanks Keith 

@keithh 

I remember reading somewhere, and I'm not certain if it is to do with requiring planning permission or for RHI payments, that you are normally limited to installing only one ASHP. I appreciate your thinking that two smaller units may be more efficient than one large one, but this may not be the case.

As you may be aware, heating say 5 rooms as against 10 will not reduce your energy consumption by 50%, there will be leakage of heat energy from the heated rooms to the unheated rooms. You would also need to be careful that it does not cause dampness.

From the knowledge that I have gained concerning ASHP's, with regard to achieving the highest efficiency and the lowest energy consumption, it is necessary to concentrate on the following areas:-

Improve insulation levels as much as possible.

Ensure that the maximum amount of heat energy can be supplied at the lowest water flow temperature, by having the maximum heating capacity available from the installed heat emitters (radiators and/or UFH). Restricting the output from some of your radiators by using TRV's may mean that other radiators need to work harder, and hence require a higher water flow temperature which in turn would reduce the ASHP's efficiency.

Keep the desired indoor air temperature setting as low as possible to achieve personal comfort levels.

Ensure that weather compensation is both enabled and optimised for your home. A system that uses weather compensation along with room temperature adaptation will probably provide the best results.

If at all possible avoid having a system that incorporates a buffer tank or low loss header, but should one be necessary then ensure that the water flows around the system are correctly balanced. 

@keithh, welcome to the forums. Derek is spot. The UK government has these lofty targets (600,000 is the minimum amount of annual installations by 2028) and yet homeowners can't seem to find installers which is worrying.

My recommendation is to start with the installer database on the MCS website: https://mcscertified.com/find-an-installer

Given that your house is complex, I would certainly advise you to get at least three installers to come and quote and give you their recommendations. That'll be a starting point to point you in the right direction. There are also many ways you can heat or not heat rooms with various controllers (like smart TRVs and smart thermostats), but that is something that should be up to the installers to design.

A lot of the large heat pump manufacturers also have installers listed on their websites that they recommend. Renewable Energy Devices (RED) also offer a design service in the UK, and you might want to check them out: http://www.red-limited.com

Here's a recent interview we have with the managing director which you may find interesting: https://youtu.be/6SSs4OqQeBk

@keithh 

Hi Keith,

I hope you were not offended by my comment about Mr. Johnson, I'm afraid that I have come to the conclusion that our politicians, and probably their advisors, live in some parallel universe, and don't fully understand the realities of the real world.

Not having had to search for an ASHP installer myself, I think that Mars has offered the best advice, to look on the MCS website.

Rather than concentrating on finding a local installer, I would suggest that you try to find someone who fully understands ASHP's, and knows how to design a system that not only meets your requirements, but also operates in a reliable and efficient manner.

The important thing to remember is that ASHP's are not like gas or oil boilers, in that the energy content of their fuel source varies, which means that the overall design and operation of the system becomes much more important.

Dereck & Mars 

Again many thanks for the comments 

I have tried many MCS installers and managed to get one to come and view to check the room sizes for heat loss but since then will not return and calls or emails so wont even say he doesn't want the project 

I have also approached many suppliers via there web sites and still no response i appreciate they may be getting lots of enquires but if they don't respond for many days what is there service going to be like 

so in a real catch 22 if i can only get one quote how do i check to see if they are overcharging me because they take one look at the house and the location and think MONEY 

Not understanding how we worked so hard to get to this property 

Again thanks for all the support but getting very despondent trying to get quotes and find a good installer which seems to be the main issue when people are having issues with the system not working correctly  

A real mine field out there 

Regards Keith 

@keithh, it's very, very frustrating that homeowners want to go green but aren't getting the support from installers. MCS is starting a point, but there's no guarantee that the installers will be able to design an efficient system around what you already have. This too, is a big challenge. 

@grahamh, do you know and recommend anyone that cover the Daventry/Northamptonshire area?

@derek-m, there's nothing for anyone to take any offence about the PM's office. They have driven the market to decarbonise and identified heat pumps as the solution, but they haven't gone beyond that to get more robust schemes in place and to put plans in place to get 1 million heat pumps installed per year. The industry is currently on doing around 30,000 a year. All the associations that deal with renewable heating are very disappointed. 

Hi Keith,

Sorry to hear about your problems with installers. We had a system fitted in the summer and to be honest, it was a total nightmare getting quotes - I contacted pretty much everyone in our local area and even outside of it. The sum total of about 50 calls and emails for a quote was one large regional company that (very reluctantly) came out to quote and a good local company that we used in the end. I think it just comes down to them being crazy busy with the end of RHI in sight and being able to pick and choose who they quote for. I made a thread on our installation (our Shropshire ASHP installation) you can find if you go back a few weeks. We had a really difficult installation with quite a few problems during and after the installation but it was all ironed out and now (touch wood!) seems to be working really well - the RHI covers about 70% of the cost, which took the sting out a bit and the novelty of having a warm house everywhere (rather than just around our log burners) is just wonderful, well worth the effort. Bills aren't too bad sofar and the costs for a mild autumn have been negligible, although I can see the pump is on a lot more in Nov than it was in Sep/Oct.

Good luck getting the installation - the best single bit of advice I can give is to get a good installer that you trust and who has a good support network. You will get issues that need sorting (we had heaps of teething problems) and you need someone who can get out to you quickly if/when something goes wrong.

Siko 

Many thanks for the reply and i fully agree with all your comments and there must be so many people in the same position who just give up 

Regards Keith 

@keithh 

We’ve just had our instal about 2 weeks ago and suffering the odd teething problem.  Over all however things seem to be going well now.   Like you we had similar nightmares getting people to respond to contact via all manner of means.  We also had the same issues with cavity wall insulation installers prior.  I think people are monster busy and that applies to all trades I think.  It was explained to me by a plumber for our new shower as a lockdown boom.  As in people were forced to stay home so no spending on meals out, theatre, holidays, weekends away etc.  As lockdown restrictions eased folk had spare cash and so were able to get their extensions, new bathroom, kitchen etc.  Hence unable to book builders and the like as they’re now all booked solid for many months ahead.

Good luck.