@derek-m & technogeek
Question:
How do I measure Electrical Signals and integrate them with Temperature Sensors ?
Your comment that "It is unclear what your charts are measuring or designed to show." demonstrates the problem that has been apparent from the beginning.
Measurement problems:
I can easily measure, and store , water Temperatures at any given time.
I have many DS18B20 's , K type pipe Clamp Temperature sensors and a Sharky " In Water power" meter.
I also have flow meters but cannot integrate the flow measurements Signals with Temperature measurements!
In general , I have no method of measuring Electrical signals , for example Motor relays , Water flow Sensors and integrate them with the temperature sensors.
Fast Signals . eg PWM I can measure , and store in an Oscilloscope but cannot integrate these Files with the Slow Temperature Signals.
Question 1:
How do I measure Electrical Signals and integrate them with Temperature Sensors ?
Oscilloscopes have a completely different Timebase compared to Temperature Sensors.
Question 2:
How do I correlate Relays and motors with Temperature Sensors?
Warning: Only perform tests and work on your equipment for which you have been adequately trained and you are deemed competent. Follow all necessary safety procedures.
What Arduino equipment do you have?
Whether a water pump is running or not is a binary state, so could be measured by a digital input on a monitoring device. One way to infer that a water pump is operational would be to monitor the power supply to its motor, but most monitoring equipment would not be capable of accepting a 240v ac input. It would therefore be necessary to use an interposing relay, to separate the 240v ac from a probable low voltage dc signal. A relay with a 240v ac coil connected across the power supply to the water pump would be energised at the same time as the pump. The contacts of the relay could then be used to switch a low voltage dc signal to the monitoring equipment.
An alternative would be to use a flow switch, which again could be used to switch a low voltage dc signal.
The use of temperature sensors at different locations can also be used to infer that water flow is taking place.
Monitoring AC mains Motors , Relays and Actuator valves on Samsung Heat Pumps.
I have reluctantly, because of cost, decided to buy a pair of Oscilloscope Current , CT probes.
Outwith Oscilloscope use ,these can easily, and safely, be connected to another Arduino dumping data to either a PC or a SD Card.
My Pipe Water Temperature Measurements:
1: In Water Temperature Measurement:
Water Temperatures are most accurately measured using the in Water Power Meters.
The In Water Power meter accurately measures the Water Temperature.
2: K Type Clamp pipe Temperature Measurements:
Water Temperatures can be approximately measured using K type thermocouples mounted on K type pipe clamps.
The K Types Clamps being easily moved to different locations.
All Thermocouples, suffer from offsets, drift and signal noise.
The Thermocouples here measure ONLY the Temperature of the copper pipe, Not the Water within the pipe.
3: DS18B20 Digital Sensors:
Water Temperatures can be approximately measured using DS18B20 digital sensors fitted externally to the pipes.
The DS18B20 Sensors provide a fast serial Digital Temperature Measurement easily accessible from Arduino Micros.
The DS18B20 here measures ONLY the Temperature of the copper pipe, Not the Water within the pipe.
Pipe Water Flow rates:
1: In Water Power Meter:
The In Water Power meters provide a accurate measurement of Water Flow Rates using Ultrasonic in -Water Sensors.
@derek-m @technogeek @Mars
When is a Thermostat NOT a Thermostat ?
Can my "Honeywell "Home Thermostat be called a Thermostat?
Thermostat , implies a Binary ON-OFF Switch , when my Honeywell is actually a Pulse Width Modulated Signal Temperature transmitted as a "Run Time" variable pulse width on a fixed Cycle Time?
A binary state device it is NOT!
What Temperature Sensor or Thermostat Should I use ?
Given my recent discovery that my Thermostat has been the source of my " Short Cycling" what Thermostat would be an appropriate Replacement?
My Current Honeywell "Home" Thermostat is in fact a kind of Pulse Width Modulated, PWM device .
The Honeywell "Home" runs on a CONSTANT Cycle Time with each Cycle staring with a Variable Pulse Width Run Time.
Ironically, This Thermostat appears to be designed to fix cycle times thus countering the effects of variable cycling!
The primary task of a room thermostat in a heat pump system is to limit over temperature due to solar gain or human activity. A 'smart' thermostat may therefore not be appropriate for this purpose, a basic on/off type being the preferred option.
Actual IAT control should be performed by the heat pump controller.
Posted by: @iantelescopeWhat Temperature Sensor or Thermostat Should I use ?
Can you not use the Samsung wired remote controller as your thermostat? If you need to move its location, it is just a question of running a length of two core wire to the new location. My controller was moved from an outside porch to an internal room and has replaced my 3rd party thermostat very successfully. If you don't want to do that I would recommend an ESRTP4RF+ thermostat made by ESIcontrols.
Posted by: @mike-hPosted by: @iantelescopeWhat Temperature Sensor or Thermostat Should I use ?
Can you not use the Samsung wired remote controller as your thermostat? If you need to move its location, it is just a question of running a length of two core wire to the new location. My controller was moved from an outside porch to an internal room and has replaced my 3rd party thermostat very successfully. If you don't want to do that I would recommend an ESRTP4RF+ thermostat made by ESIcontrols.
It would appear that the suggested ESI Controls thermostat operates in the same manner as the present Honeywell thermostat, so may not provide any form of improvement.
A heat pump system operates better with just a basic on/off type thermostat.
Posted by: @derek-mIt would appear that the suggested ESI Controls thermostat operates in the same manner as the present Honeywell thermostat, so may not provide any form of improvement.
This was not my experience. It operated purely as an on off thermostat. I believe that with additional wiring, it does have additional functionality, which is probably what you are referring to. However with the basic wiring it is just an on off thermostat.
Posted by: @mike-hPosted by: @derek-mIt would appear that the suggested ESI Controls thermostat operates in the same manner as the present Honeywell thermostat, so may not provide any form of improvement.
This was not my experience. It operated purely as an on off thermostat. I believe that with additional wiring, it does have additional functionality, which is probably what you are referring to. However with the basic wiring it is just an on off thermostat.
I would suggest that you read section 1.3 What is Chronoproportional Control (TPI)?
This states that the thermostat 'TPI increase
boiler efficiency by firing the boiler at regular intervals,
adjusting firing duration with demand'.
Posted by: @derek-mI would suggest that you read section 1.3 What is Chronoproportional Control (TPI)?
This states that the thermostat 'TPI increase
boiler efficiency by firing the boiler at regular intervals,
adjusting firing duration with demand'.
Er isn't that just like any thermostat, but with a (possibly synthesised) small hysteresis. Why does having a shorter cycle time make a boiler more efficient?
4kW peak of solar PV since 2011; EV and a 1930s house which has been partially renovated to improve its efficiency. 7kW Vaillant heat pump.
Posted by: @derek-mI would suggest that you read section 1.3 What is Chronoproportional Control (TPI)?
This states that the thermostat 'TPI increase
boiler efficiency by firing the boiler at regular intervals,
adjusting firing duration with demand'.
Er isn't that just like any thermostat, but with a (possibly synthesised) small hysteresis. Why does having a shorter cycle time make a boiler more efficient?
4kW peak of solar PV since 2011; EV and a 1930s house which has been partially renovated to improve its efficiency. 7kW Vaillant heat pump.
Posted by: @jamespaPosted by: @derek-mI would suggest that you read section 1.3 What is Chronoproportional Control (TPI)?
This states that the thermostat 'TPI increase
boiler efficiency by firing the boiler at regular intervals,
adjusting firing duration with demand'.Er isn't that just like any thermostat, but with a (possibly synthesised) small hysteresis. Why does having a shorter cycle time make a boiler more efficient?
You may be correct James. I suppose it depends what is meant by 'firing the boiler at regular intervals', is this every 20 minutes, but varying the on period during that 20 minutes?
I have just noticed further down that section 'This thermostat has the option of standard setting or TPI' so it would appear that it can be used in basic on/off mode. Mea Culpa. 🙄
- 27 Forums
- 2,495 Topics
- 57.8 K Posts
- 313 Online
- 6,220 Members
Join Us!
Worth Watching
Latest Posts
-
RE: Electricity price predictions
I agree. The more I read, the more I feel there are mul...
By Old_Scientist , 8 minutes ago
-
RE: Our Experience installing a heat pump into a Grade 2 Listed stone house
@travellingwave A straight line like that in recorde...
By RobS , 18 minutes ago
-
RE: Rate the quality of your heat pump design and installation
@jamespa trustpilot has a reasonable reputation of coll...
By Gmuzz , 26 minutes ago
-
RE: Testing new controls/monitoring for Midea Clone ASHP
Ah, that is much clearer, my manual doesn't have the st...
By cathodeRay , 54 minutes ago
-
RE: Solis inverters S6-EH1P: pros and cons and battery options
Which is why ,I assume,Fogstar fit the JK balancer to t...
By Jancold , 57 minutes ago
-
RE: The Hidden Secret to a Successful Heat Pump: Pipe Size Matters
If your heat loss is only 4kW and the pipes leaving the...
By JamesPa , 1 hour ago
-
RE: Humidity, or lack thereof... is my heat pump making rooms drier?
My 2 bed mid-terrace definitely dropped consistently af...
By RadWhisperer , 5 hours ago
-
RE: Struggling to get CoP above 3 with 6 kw Ecodan ASHP
@goodbyegas Hi Fellow Ecodan owner here. Looking a...
By Travellingwave , 15 hours ago
-
RE: Say hello and introduce yourself
You can send private messages via the Messages (envelop...
By cathodeRay , 18 hours ago
-
RE: Peak Energy Products V therm 16kW unit heat pump not reaching flow temperature
With complete radio silence from Peak and no sign of th...
By DaveC , 18 hours ago
-
I understand now what you were referring to. This look...
By trebor12345 , 20 hours ago
-
RE: What determines the SOC of a battery?
@batpred I would consider changing your balance star...
By Bash , 21 hours ago
-
RE: Setback savings - fact or fiction?
This illustrates what I am getting at, even apparent st...
By cathodeRay , 1 day ago
-
No you arent, because you dont need any, and furthermor...
By JamesPa , 1 day ago
-
RE: Oversized 10.5kW Grant Aerona Heat Pump on Microbore Pipes and Undersized Rads
As I mentioned earlier most radiators have a power outp...
By JamesPa , 1 day ago
-
@painter26 — they (the analogue gauges) are subtly diff...
By cathodeRay , 2 days ago
-
RE: Getting ready for export with a BESS
I would have not got it if it was that tight
By Batpred , 3 days ago
-
RE: Need help maximising COP of 3.5kW Valiant Aerotherm heat pump
@judith thanks Judith. Confirmation appreciated. The ...
By DavidB , 3 days ago
-
RE: Recommended home battery inverters + regulatory matters - help requested
That makes sense. I thought better to comment in this t...
By Batpred , 3 days ago
-
Bosch CS5800i 7kW replacing Greenstar Junior 28i
My heat pump journey began a couple of years ago when I...
By Slartibartfast , 3 days ago
-
RE: How to control DHW with Honeywell EvoHome on Trianco ActiveAir 5 kW ASHP
The last photo is defrost for sure (or cooling, but pre...
By JamesPa , 3 days ago
-
RE: Plug and play solar. Thoughts?
Essentially, this just needed legislation. In Germany t...
By Batpred , 3 days ago
-
RE: A Smarter Smart Controller from Homely?
@toodles Intentional opening of any warranty “can of wo...
By Papahuhu , 3 days ago


