Very Strong Warning from EST , HES and Scottish Government.

I have just received a "Urgent" E-mail from EST , HES Scotland.

EST Scotland is warning about "deliberate misinterpretation" by some "installers" concerning MCS authorisation for Hybrid-Heat-Pumps.

I am NOT surprised!

Have similar warnings been issued in England?

ian

@heacol 

Very Strong Warning from EST , HES and Scottish Government.

I have just received a "Urgent" E-mail from EST , HES Scotland.

EST Scotland is warning about "deliberate misinterpretation" by some "installers" concerning MCS authorisation for Hybrid-Heat-Pumps.

I am NOT surprised!

Have similar warnings been issued in England?

Speaking from experience over 18 months of pain , BE VERY SCEPTICAL ABOUT YOUR  "INSTALLER"

ian

@west 

Hi, I totally understand !

I have been trying to get my Samsung Heat pump to work efficiently for 15 months .....without success.

I am now being prepared for a confrontation with my "Installer " , refereed by an NIC Engineer.

I have just received the following "urgent message" from the EST Scotland and Home Energy Scotland.

With my "installer" having been Twice struck OFF for "incompetence" you might think I have an open and shut case, but from previous experience with the MCS,NIC and RECC I am VERY sceptical!

My Samsung Heat pump has a faulty Pulse Width Modulated ,PWM driver,  with considerable  "short cycling"   ( < 10 minute cycle Period, 30-80 times per day ) , poor efficiency ( 24 % Energy loss) and an increased energy bill of 75% compared to it's Gas predecessor!

My Advice to all "do it yourself !".......

ian

Posted by: @iantelescope

↑

Could I better present my measurement problem with a specific example.

 

I have a Heat Pump with a Heat Exchanger dividing the Water circuit into two water circuits.

I need to measure the Water Temperatures at the Two input ports and the two output ports.

However, all four ports are physically connected to the Steel copper chassis of the heat exchanger.

How can I measure the Water Temperatures, and not the chassis temperature,  at all four ports?

 

better with the example. Obvious options:

- move the measurement points so they are still on the same pipe, but further away from the metal mass of the heat exchanger.

- if breaking into the plumbing is an option, fit some thermowells into the pipework either side of the HEX.

@iancalderbank 

I soldered on small diameter copper pipes onto the pipes feeding into and out of the heatpump, both house side, so they both just have water in them (no glycol).  The pipes have temperature sensors inserted, then are covered with tape and insulation.  Don’t remember why two pipes each side, spare presumably.

With my "installer" being now "STRUCK OFF " for third , and hopefully final time , I am now left with a system with running  costs about twice that of the gas boiler it replaced.

The Heat pump, with an absolute maximum of 3.5 kw power output ( as measured by a Sharky water Power meter)   does not provide enough heat to heat my living room let alone my house when outside temperatures dip below +3 C.

The Water heater , being completely unaffordable, has been replaced by a Electric shower unit, with a kitchen electric under sink water heater to follow.  .

The Heat pump originally "designed" to provide circa 6.5 kW actually  produces between  2kW and  3.5 kW as measured by the Sharky when the outside temperature is less than +3 C.

The Heat pump is "short cycling" with up to 90 oscillations with each oscillation consisting of a 5 minute Running time and a 11 minute Cycling time.

Visits by the "installers" accompanied by an "engineer" from the NIC resulted in the final demise of my "installers" with a final "STRIKE OFF" for fabricating the results of their EPC Certification to justify the Heat pump they finally "installed".

@iantelescope, that’s terrible. What are you going to do? Did you pay in full for the installation?

Well this sounds promising 😱 

@editor 

Reference my appalling "installer" and the NIC "Regulators".

The Money

I initially applied for a grant loan of £9k from the Energy Savings Trust, Scotland, EST Scotland in April 2022.

The very complicated, boring story continues to this day with my "installer" now being STRUCK OFF for the third time.

With my "installer" being STRUCK OFF by the NIC, the EST refused to reimburse me for the Grant/loan until December 2022 when £6K was paid into my bank account covering the initial "installation".

Preparation Costs

My Microbore piping and my Radiators were replaced at a cost , to me, of £3.2k with the gas supply removal costing £922.80 boiler with added insulation costing a further £1500.

Total preparatory costs circa £5.5k.

The NIC

The NIC have, on several occasions, verbally promised to fix and or replace my Heat pump but , in writing the NIC have said that 

" you are not going to like this.................. but

nothing can be done ...........you should seek Legal opinion". December 2023.......

Do it yourself !

I am resigned to fixing this myself, having lost all trust in either the MCS, the NIC or my "installer"!

Help appreciated

I have, however, great respect for the help of my MSP, the EST Scotland and the RECC.

@iantelescope Sounds like you had better luck than me EST / HES caused most of my issues, NAPIT have sent 2 inspectors so far RECC and MCS have done nothing so far, they all seem to protect themselves my MSP and MP tried but was shut down by the Scottish Government's Patrick Harvey Green Party

@west 

Re: my experience with the MCS and the NIC .

My "installer" was repeatedly STUCK OFF by the NIC for various offences against both myself and other customers, only  to be later re-instated. No reason was ever given as to who or why my "installer" was re-instated.

Contacting  EST SCOTLAND

After months of frustration in trying to get through the peripheral ring of Telephones surrounding the EST, my MSP arranged direct contact with a manager within the EST.

A CLAIM

With a contact within  EST SCOTLAND  I was , after several months, paid my initial £6k despite my "installer" being STRUCK OFF by the NIC for "incompetence.

A Plumbers does NOT make a good Heat Pump Engineer!

All the "engineers" supplied by my "installer" were  former plumbers.

Every "Engineer" , on arrival, swiftly interrogated "YOUTUBE Videos " as their  Heat pump manual , even when presented with a totally different model of Heat Pump!

A house Electrician Does NOT make a good, or safe, Heat pump Engineer!

The Former Electricians were  better than their plumbing cousins but prone to connecting cables using the electrical equivalent of clothes pegs!.

The MCS and NIC Foundation principals

The MCS and the NIC, set up under the slogan  "light touch regulation" have produced a system with no discipline , education or regulation. Just what the politician ordered!

ian

@witchcraft

Your Quote  perfectly reflects my experience  about my "installer"

  "Long story short MCS are quite hopeless, my installer (and seemingly lots of others), were simply plumbers who know very little about ASHPs but have jumped on the green bandwagon,"............................................

I should say that I do sincerely feel for the plumbers who actually turn up to try and fix  my Heat pump with no experience , no circuit diagrams , no spare parts, no recorded metering and no confidence in their management.

The Foreman in charge of my "installation" was forced to lie about having "previously installed" six other Samsung Heat Pumps.

The Foreman had, as became obvious during the first month of the "installation", had no experience what so ever of Samsung heat pumps.