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alternative to Homely - HavenWise. Anyone used it?

Tim441 · 2024-10-08T14:39:51Z

Interesting article in the Telegraph.. includes: HavenWise for heat pumps. Has anyone heard of it.. or used it? Extract: The established brands include Homely and PassivUK, whose optimisers have been independently shown to save 20 to 30pc. The latest entrant is a start-up called HavenWise, the brainchild of Alex Nelson, a former captain in the Royal Logistic Corps with a masters degree in robotics, and backed by Carbon13, a climate technology investor. Last spring, HavenWise demonstrated its system on my heat pump during two days of near-identical weather and the result was astonishing. The combination of its optimiser and the Agile tariff worked out 60pc cheaper than a standard tariff with no optimisation. The company says it achieved similar results in longer tests with other heat pumps. On that basis, had I been using Agile and HavenWise over the previous year, my heat pump bill would have fallen from £1,194 to £478, a saving of £717. My total electricity bill (I don’t have gas) would not have come out at £2,096 – roughly in line with the average Ofgem tariff and Energy Price Guarantee over the previous year – but a third lower at £1,379. For this year, if the weather and Agile tariffs stay the same – which they won’t – and with the Ofgem cap at £1,717, I’m guessing it would be around £1,200. But these savings are at the upper end of what HavenWise would expect, cautioned Mr Nelson, because I had not previously been running the heat pump in its most efficient weather-compensation mode. As the company tests its algorithm on many more heat pumps this winter, it expects the savings to be lower. “It’s difficult to forecast precisely”, said Mr Nelson, “but we think the average savings will settle at around 50pc.” If optimisers can deliver savings of more than 30pc, it could give heat pumps a decisive advantage over gas boilers, according to Nesta, a clean energy think tank. Its modelling shows that with the current installation subsidy of £7,500, heat pumps would then undercut boilers on the total cost of ownership – including purchase, installation, maintenance and 15 years of energy bills. “If the optimiser can save 30pc, heat pumps would cost less than a boiler every month, all in”, said Andrew Sissons, deputy director of Nesta. “That makes it easier for banks to offer financing to eliminate the upfront cost for the consumer, so this could be a pivotal moment.” Those kinds of deals are already beginning to emerge. Swedish company Aira is installing heat pumps in the UK at no upfront cost. The Heat Geek installer network has launched a similar offer which includes an efficiency guarantee. Homely and PassivUK’s optimisers work through small electronic devices costing around £200 that need to be wired into the heat pump by an approved installer. HavenWise operates through the cloud and needs no extra equipment – provided the heat pump is Wi-Fi enabled – and will charge an annual subscription of £50.

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Mars

(@editor)

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30/01/2025 9:35 pm

@broadsman a representative from Samsung has replied as follows: “we didn't do any promotions for free WiFi kits last year. Our integrated unit comes with the WiFi kit inbuilt, the other you buy separately which the part number is the MIM H04EN. The part number listed there might be a typo in it, as its either BEK or DEK. Any of our distributions can supply the kit.

If the installer ordered via a distributor we would have sent it. Some of our distributors also stock them.”

This post was modified 10 months ago by Mars

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HCas

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30/01/2025 9:38 pm

@davidalgarve Works outside of the UK as well!

CEO and co-founder at HavenWise

👍

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Morgan

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31/01/2025 8:09 am

@hcas

But first I have to remove any controls I've set up here such as scheduled setbacks and temp variations?

Also what mode do I set the ASHP to work with Havenwise? Presently I run on a weather comp and occasionally auto-adapt mode.

Do I need to remove the Legionella schedule in order not to clash with Havenwise control?

Any other settings I need to remove before handing over control to Havenwise?

Retrofitted 11.2kw Mitsubishi Ecodan to new radiators commissioned November 2021.
14 x 500w Monocrystalline solar panels.

2 ESS Smile G3 10.1 batteries.
ESS Smile G3 5kw inverter.

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Broadsman

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31/01/2025 8:17 am

@editor Thank you; I'm near Norwich.

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HCas

(@hcas)

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31/01/2025 8:22 am

Hi @morgan! You can link up your heat pump to our systems without changing anything. We then take a look at how it's set up and running, and might ask you a few quick questions. Once we switch on the Havenwise control afterwards, we can get the heat pump in the right mode ourselves. The only thing you would have to do at that point is remove schedules (if you have any) from your physical Mitsubishi controller.

CEO and co-founder at HavenWise

👍

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Mars

(@editor)

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31/01/2025 8:34 am

Posted by: @editor

↑

@broadsman a representative from Samsung has replied as follows: “we didn't do any promotions for free WiFi kits last year. Our integrated unit comes with the WiFi kit inbuilt, the other you buy separately which the part number is the MIM H04EN. The part number listed there might be a typo in it, as its either BEK or DEK. Any of our distributions can supply the kit.

If the installer ordered via a distributor we would have sent it. Some of our distributors also stock them.”

@broadsman, this is the reply above from Samsung.

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Broadsman

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31/01/2025 12:36 pm

@editor Thank you. However, I was told in a telephone conversation with a tech guy at Samsung Aircon services that there should be a specific part/adapter included within the box/container of the integrated pumps to just plug in and that the kit number is DB98-40278A. I have downloaded the manual for that part, and on Page 6 it gives instructions for the model number of my pump. It is this part/adapter that was missing from my pump on delivery.

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Alfapat

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31/01/2025 4:01 pm

It looks like I can fit Modbus to my Gen 5 Heat pump , I have been sent an instruction to change the installion on my Samsung Controller.

My question remains Homely or Havenwise

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Toodles

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31/01/2025 4:07 pm

@alfapat My only experience is with Homely. Regards, Toodles.

Toodles, heats his home with cold draughts and cooks food with magnets.

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Arundalep

(@arundalep)

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02/02/2025 10:08 am

@broadsman if you already have the Modbus interface for the Planet device you could repurpose that for use with Homely (making installation very simple and save you money).

You would have to check with Planet regarding Homely and Planet on the same Modbus network (depending on how Planet talks on the network it may interfere with Homely) and you may have to disconnect the Planet interface.

The Samsung WiFi interface is disappointing from a user point of view but it does then allow connection to third party systems through the SmartThings API (like Havenwise).

I have tried both methods for communicating with my Samsung and ditched both in favour of a much more geeky Home Assistant / Custom approach to allow me to take advantage of Intelligent Octopus and have much better control and monitoring. At the time, nothing available will work with Intelligent (Homely cannot do dynamic tariff optimisation, only TOU or day ahead).

Optimising controls for your heat pump is a great idea. You don’t have to worry about setting weather compensation, sudden cold snaps, electricity tariffs etc, they just take care of it.

My issue was the inflexible nature of Homely and their refusal to accommodate external inputs. It’s great for more basic setups but if you have solar, battery, a dynamic electricity tariff etc it won’t cope.

good luck

Pau

1970’s 3 bed detached house in West Sussex. Mains gas disconnected September 2023.
Samsung HTQ 8kW heat pump using mostly existing radiators. House is warm 24/7 (normally between 20.3-20.6 C but currently with a newborn its 21-21.2 C).
Sunamp for hot water storage.
Solaredge 6kWp PV and 10kWh battery
Vehicle 2 Grid charger (used with a Leaf)
Wallbox EV charger (installed for Octopus Intelligent).
Home Assistant used for HEMS with lots of custom ESP devices to allow integration.

Insulation upgrades:
EPS cavity wall insulation.
Improved loft insulation (renewed and 300mm where possible).

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Broadsman

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03/02/2025 2:20 pm

@arundalep Thanks, I will bear that in mind if Mars is unable to sort out my missing part. However, I'd be interested to know what you felt Havenwise lacked in the type of control you were looking for though.

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Mars

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03/02/2025 2:22 pm

@broadsman it's gone quiet with Samsung. I'll prompt them again.

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