My neighbour (a Daily Mail reader) has just had a new boiler fitted replacing a 30 year old Potterton. She knows I have the Ecodan and am happy with it but almost visibly shuddered when I suggested she should get one.
I then pointed out that she already owned three heat pumps - her fridge, freezer and split air conditioner, installed about 15 years ago - and was met with a blank stare.
On the renaming topic, I agree probably better to stick with what we have. But if push came to shove, I think "Heat collector" is worth consideration as an alternative.
Mitsubishi Zubadan 14kW with Mixergy 210l DHW in 220m2 barn property. 24 solar panels = 9kWp with GivEnergy 5.0kW Hybrid inverter and 19kWh GivE batteries. Jaga Strada fan-assisted rads throughout. Landvac vacuum glazing/triple glazed windows.
@downfield Warming McWarmFace? 😉 Toodles.
Toodles, he heats his home with cold draughts and cooks his food with magnets.
@toodles - very good! How about Heaty McHeatFace?
More mundanely, having thought about it, and yes I know it is not very creative, I do think 'heat pump' is the best term. It's short, two one syllable words, and it does succinctly describe what it does (the it does what it says on the tin test). A pump is device that moves something, usually (but not always, eg a proton pump) a liquid or a gas, from A to B (and a heat pump does do that, as the means to move what it really moves), and by adding 'heat' it tells us that it's primary purpose is to pump (move) heat from A , outside, to B, inside. If it (the name) ain't broke, then don't fix it!
Midea 14kW (for now...) ASHP heating both building and DHW
Posted by: @downfieldMy neighbour (a Daily Mail reader) has just had a new boiler fitted replacing a 30 year old Potterton. She knows I have the Ecodan and am happy with it but almost visibly shuddered when I suggested she should get one.
I then pointed out that she already owned three heat pumps - her fridge, freezer and split air conditioner, installed about 15 years ago - and was met with a blank stare.
On the renaming topic, I agree probably better to stick with what we have. But if push came to shove, I think "Heat collector" is worth consideration as an alternative.
...which is why boilers eventually need to be banned. I don't doubt that similarly minded people will/have complained about recent floods. They need to learn that you cant have everything (that's more or less a function of the laws of thermodynamics). Sadly, when politicians speak that truth, they get criticised down and eventually voted out.
I made a resolution a while ago that, when someone tells me how bad some decision made by a politician is (at any level and of any political persuasion), I simply ask them, 'OK, so if you don't like what x is doing, what would you do?' Some times they just give an answer which is physically impossible, but more often than not it forces them to think. Whether it has any long term effect I don't know, but the fact is that criticism is cheap, solutions are rather more difficult!
4kW peak of solar PV since 2011; EV and a 1930s house which has been partially renovated to improve its efficiency. 7kW Vaillant heat pump.
I'm not suggesting this is a better name, but isn't it more of a Temperature pump than a Heat pump, in that it raises temperature?
So it collects heat and pumps up the temperature?
Mitsubishi Zubadan 14kW with Mixergy 210l DHW in 220m2 barn property. 24 solar panels = 9kWp with GivEnergy 5.0kW Hybrid inverter and 19kWh GivE batteries. Jaga Strada fan-assisted rads throughout. Landvac vacuum glazing/triple glazed windows.
Posted by: @downfieldI'm not suggesting this is a better name, but isn't it more of a Temperature pump than a Heat pump, in that it raises temperature?
So it collects heat and pumps up the temperature?
Maybe not. The point about pumps of all kinds is that they act against the natural flow of what they pump, and that is exactly what a heat pump does.
Water naturally flows downhill, due to the laws of gravity. If you want water to go uphill you use a water pump.
Energy (heat) naturally moves from a warm body to a cold body, due to the laws of thermodynamics. If you want energy to move from a cold body (the outside air) to a warm body (the inside air) you use a heat pump.
Temperature cannot be pumped as its just a measure of the amount of thermal energy in a body not something that can flow. Its the energy that is pumped!
4kW peak of solar PV since 2011; EV and a 1930s house which has been partially renovated to improve its efficiency. 7kW Vaillant heat pump.
@downfield Temperature Elevator? Toodles.
Toodles, he heats his home with cold draughts and cooks his food with magnets.
@jamespa Yes of course you are correct.
I was just thinking about the layman's concept of what a heat pump is doing, and at a superficial level it seems as though it is converting/ (transforming?) a low temperature to a high temperature.
Mitsubishi Zubadan 14kW with Mixergy 210l DHW in 220m2 barn property. 24 solar panels = 9kWp with GivEnergy 5.0kW Hybrid inverter and 19kWh GivE batteries. Jaga Strada fan-assisted rads throughout. Landvac vacuum glazing/triple glazed windows.
Posted by: @downfield@jamespa Yes of course you are correct.
I was just thinking about the layman's concept of what a heat pump is doing, and at a superficial level it seems as though it is converting/ (transforming?) a low temperature to a high temperature.
Fair enough, but the idea of a pump and the idea of energy/heat are both familiar to laymen, so I can't see we need to do anything (by way of explanation) other than tell people that it is pumping energy (or heat), which is exactly what it is doing. People are also familiar with the fact that hot things get cold when placed near cold things! You cant really 'convert' temperatures any more than you can 'convert' the height of water in a bucket. You can raise it by putting more water in, or lower it by pouring water out, but you cant convert it.
In my book 'every day is a school day', and if we dumb down/misrepresent things that people are perfectly capable of understanding (which most are I would suggest) then we are on a slippery slope to facts becoming 'flexible' or 'matters of opinion'.
I fully support (and actually quite enjoy the challenge of) keeping explanations of everyday devices as simple as possible (whilst remaining reasonably accurate), but I personally find it difficult to see how one could improve on either the simplicity or accuracy of 'heat pump'.
4kW peak of solar PV since 2011; EV and a 1930s house which has been partially renovated to improve its efficiency. 7kW Vaillant heat pump.
There is, or at least there used to be until all the text books got rewritten, something called abstract conceptual thought. It's basically an ability to think in the abstract, and by no means everyone has this ability. Take for example a red biscuit tin, and ask someone without abstract conceptual thought whether it is (a) blue or (b) not blue. They won't get the question, and will what do you mean, it's red. GPs using clever fancy analogies to explain illness are likely to come up against similar baffled responses from their patients who lack abstract conceptual thought.
All of which is to say we should call a spade a spade, and a thing that pumps heat (energy, but as it is in the form of heat, let's stick with heat) a heat pump. @jamespa has hit the hail on the head, pumps are things that move things against their natural flow, and you don't need abstract conceptual thought to understand that, I think it is fair to say all understand that a bicycle pump puts air in a place where it won't naturally go. Likewise heat, or warmth, is a universal experience that all can understand. Given these things what is the simplest, clearest name for some thing that moves heat against the natural flow? A heat pump of course...
But - there is a problem! What a heat pump does is extract invisible heat heat from the colder outside air, and somehow gets it into the warmer house. I think that is where the problem lies, because you need to understand the abstract conceptual thought that the outside colder air still has enough heat in it, heat that that can be extracted and then pumped into the house. So maybe heat extractor? No, because for most people a household extractor gets rid of something they don't want - eg extractor fans - which is the opposite of what a heat pump does (though of course we do use extract in other circumstances to get something from out there and pull it in to where we want and can use it, as in extracting (dare I even mention this) fossil fuels from out there, so we can burn them in our homes and cars.
What about heat compressor? It takes the lower grade heat from outside and compresses it into something useful that we can then use to heat our homes on the inside. And a heat pump even has a compressor in it! But it is an ugly word with a lot of syllables, and lacks the concept of movement. A compressor compresses, it doesn't move.
Which leaves me with heat pump. It is a bit too clever by half (because it glosses over the how do you get useful heat from colder outside air question), but for the time being I think it remains if not the best term, then at least the least bad.
Posted by: @jamespaIn my book 'every day is a school day', and if we dumb down/misrepresent things that people are perfectly capable of understanding (which most are I would suggest) then we are on a slippery slope to facts becoming 'flexible' or 'matters of opinion'.
Couldn't agree more, the only caveat I would add is that getting the balance right between accurate but getting too complex and understandable but getting too dumbed down is not a simple matter!
Midea 14kW (for now...) ASHP heating both building and DHW
Posted by: @cathoderayBut - there is a problem! What a heat pump does is extract invisible heat heat from the colder outside air, and somehow gets it into the warmer house.
Last time I looked the air in my bicycle pump wasn't visible either!
Perhaps we should call it a reverse refrigerator, a rotaregifer (pronounced rotary_giffer or rotar_eggiffer)
4kW peak of solar PV since 2011; EV and a 1930s house which has been partially renovated to improve its efficiency. 7kW Vaillant heat pump.
@cathoderay Energy relocator is also accurate but, it doesn’t really cut the mustard does it?! Toodles.
Toodles, he heats his home with cold draughts and cooks his food with magnets.
- 22 Forums
- 2,074 Topics
- 45.4 K Posts
- 46 Online
- 3,350 Members
Join Us!
Trusted Installers
Struggling to find a reliable heat pump installer? A poor installation can lead to inefficiencies and high running costs. We now connect homeowners with top-rated installers who deliver quality work and excellent service.
✅ Verified, trusted & experienced installers
✅ Nationwide coverage expanding
✅ Special offers available
Latest Posts
-
RE: What’s the modern take on advised types of insulation?
Grant was my local MP before he lost his seat. He was...
By Jeff , 4 hours ago
-
RE: 5 Star Service from Havenwise
Thank you for tagging me @editor ! And thank you for th...
By HCas , 5 hours ago
-
RE: Radiators downstairs are cooler at the bottom after ASHP install
@melonbuffet This is great assuming now the down stairs...
By ASHP-BOBBA , 7 hours ago
-
RE: Commencing on an ASHP Installation Process
@jamespa Thanks for your input into this thread so far....
By Sheriff Fatman , 7 hours ago
-
Pacific Blue reveals ageing Codrington Wind Farm decommissioning plans.
Australia Blue, the first wind farm in Western Victoria...
By Morgan , 7 hours ago
-
RE: Ripped Off: How UK Homeowners Are Paying Gas Prices for Wind Energy
The challenge is who pays, who holds the debt and the i...
By Jeff , 13 hours ago
-
RE: Flow rate discrepancy between ASHP and manifold
That's useful thanks, I hadn't seen that table before. ...
By AshRolls , 1 day ago
-
In principle I agree, @johnmo, but with provisos. The...
By Majordennisbloodnok , 1 day ago
-
RE: Heat pump installation and BUS Grant timings
@jamespa Thats how I understood it too. 🙂
By ASHP-BOBBA , 1 day ago
-
RE: Antifreeze top up for my heat pump - is this a rip off?
@sallyl That sounds about right if they are re-filling ...
By Brendon Uys , 1 day ago
-
RE: Enabling WiFi: Samsung ASHP on Smart Things App
I would switch it off and see if anyone noticed. We use...
By Johnmo , 2 days ago
-
I wouldn't be so sure about that. Heat pump designers ...
By JamesPa , 2 days ago
-
RE: Jokes and fun posts about heat pumps and renewables
@toodles they're a rowdy bunch!
By Mars , 3 days ago
-
RE: Getting the best out of a heat pump - is Homely a possible answer?
Actually I might try just turning it off and on again…....
By benson , 3 days ago
-
RE: Home energy storage & battery register
@jamespa To a certain extent, by exporting to the grid ...
By Toodles , 3 days ago
-
RE: Forum updates, announcements & issues
@editor Fairy Nuff Mars, I doubt that my ramblings woul...
By Toodles , 4 days ago
-
RE: Confusion about heat pump sizing
We’ve published a deep dive into heat pump sizing, and ...
By Mars , 5 days ago
-
We’ve published a deep dive into heat pump sizing, and ...
By Mars , 5 days ago
-
RE: Kensa GSHP finally installed - now to start the optimisation process
Just had a quick scan of the manual and should be weath...
By Johnmo , 5 days ago